Safety of Deleting Folders on System Drive

[AmberJain]

** Split from Deleting all data on drive **

Hello,

Essentially, following that path, without rebuilding everything from scratch, is risky. Be very careful before proceeding.

Well, I agree with NeoPa on this one. If you proceed as questionit suggested then you may end up even with Windows crash. The consequence of such an action is totally unpredicted. You may get a full working system in the end OR there is an equal probability that you may later need to reinstall from scratch. And so I would prefer you to reinstall instead of deleting files manually.

NOTE-If this is your main system, do not try this...But if this system is your testbed (or whatever you would like to call it) then you may proceed to test the outcomes.

To delete them, you can choose any of these options:

1- goto Command Prompt and try deleting ............... ............... ............... ............... ............... ............... ..grams and try deleting again.

I think Unlocker is better option here....

If you delete all the folders except "Windows" folder, your O/S will be safe.

You cannot say that with certainity as I had said earlier - "The consequence of such an action is totally unpredicted."

Will i then have to recreate the other folders?

Oh yes.........cer tainly [ if you need them :) ].


HOPE THIS HELPS.........
AmbrNewlearner

[questionit]

Ambernewlearner is suggesting that deleting folders excluding Windows and Program Files may crash the Windows. I do not agree with this since any folder other than Windows is totally independent. Windows do not rely on these folders or on thier contents.

However, there could be folders used by device drivers as some devices create iseperate folders to store temporay data. If such folders are deleted, Window will still be safe but the device i.e sound card, etc might not work.

Qi

[NeoPa]

Qi,

I'm afraid that, in the interests of accuracy and the responsibility of leading others who look up to us as experts, I must disagree with your last post.

That is actually quite a dangerous thing to say. AmbrNewLearner is actually correct in that any folder or file that is referred to in Windows' Registry file can be considered as part of THAT particular Windows setup.

Ignoring the "Documents and Settings" folder for now, it is still very true to say that Windows would almost certainly fail to load correctly if all other root folders were simply deleted. "Documents and Settings" is of course a Windows folder in its own right. All user profile settings are stored there so this would have a calamatous effect if removed - all by itself.

I did try to spare your embarrassment, but I can't leave your last post suggesting to a member that it is safe to do something so very dangerous.

[questionit]

Well, NeoPa, I have tried it and not just guessing the outcome.

I know what you mean by "Windows Setup" but the thing is Windows doesn't care about it.

All it is concerned about is about "SYSTEM FILES" not any file associated with an external program that has its entry stored in Windows registry.

If someone can give it a try, do let me know then very honestly what happens.

So, check again, is there really any system file in "Documents & Settings" that Windows require to run and be safe?

I reiterate, deleting such folders might cause probelms to non O/S applications only such as Windows update files, any other updates, and ofcourse users profile data.

Qi

[AmberJain]

Hello,

Ambernewlearner is suggesting that deleting folders excluding Windows and Program Files may crash the Windows.

Yes, I am suggesting this but I would like you to read the word 'MAY' with as much stress as you can put to it i.e.

...deleting folders excluding Windows and Program Files "MAY" crash the Windows.

I mean to say that- "The consequence of such an action is totally unpredicted." I would like to quote a statement from C progamming book:

It is likely to get an error when one compiles and one will certainly get nonsense values if the program runs.

i.e. It is likely to get a system crash when one deletes all folders (except Windows and program files) and one will certainly get nonsense/unexpected problems even if Windows runs :) [And yeah...one may even get a stable system although the probability of this case is TOO low.]

I am reminded of a verse taught in elementary school- "I shot an arrow into the air, where it lands, I don't care" ;)

I do not agree with this since any folder other than Windows is totally independent. Windows do not rely on these folders or on their contents.

Windows might not rely on these folders but many windows components/files may rely on these folder to keep Windows system up and running

However, there could be folders used by device drivers as some devices create iseperate folders to store temporay data. If such folders are deleted, Window will still be safe but the device i.e sound card, etc might not work.

Well, you are partially true. There are some point that you missed....

1. If I remember correctly then virtually every windows program has an option to install to a location of users choice other than just [Program Files] which is default. And if one deletes such folders then you may end up with an unstable system.

2. Many programs (e.g. some antiviruses) put some of their important files into C:\windows OR C:\windows\syst em32 directories for their working. And if that program is not installed in [Program files] and it's files get deleted, unpredictable crashes may occur.

3. SAM (located in config folder of system32) will not be deleted even if you delete Documents and settings folder. And that may lead to corruption of all user accounts which may diallow you to log in (once you reboot) and restrict access to your system.

4. There are many important files (which are required for a working Windows system) in the root of the partition on which Windows OS is installed (e.g. boot.ini, ntldr, NTDETECT.com etc.). And if you delete them you may mess up with your system (worst then what you might think of).

5. As Sir NeoPa had said previously:

it is entirely possible that there are other folders used (and referred to in your registry) which are not contained in those three root folders. Essentially, following that path, without rebuilding everything from scratch, is risky.

And so it's not only drivers that need to be taken into consideration here, but some important files/folders too).



@daniel aristidou- You may also try restoring your PC to an earlier time (specifically if one exists at the time when you installed Windows). (I am not sure about this, though)


HOPE THIS HELPS........
AmbrNewlearner

[AmberJain]

Hello,

Well, NeoPa, I have tried it and not just guessing the outcome.

Hmmm.....Even if you had tried it and it worked, still I held my opinion same:

"The consequence of such an action is totally unpredicted."

I know what you mean by "Windows Setup" but the thing is Windows doesn't care about it.
All it is concerned about is about "SYSTEM FILES" not any file associated with an external program that has its entry stored in Windows registry.

1. boot.ini, ntldr, NTDETECT.com are not external programs.

2. What about SAM and [Documents and Settings] section? (see my previous reply).

3. Ahh....And I almost forgot this one......There is an Autorun entry at:

HKLM\SOFTWARE\M icrosoft\Window s NT\CurrentVersi on\Winlogon\use rinit

This autostart location has an entry corresponding to C:\Windows\syst em32\userinit.e xe when Windows XP is installed. Now as said in Microsoft's documentation here, some program may modify this entry to run itself before the Windows Explorer user interface starts. Now if this program is not found (i.e if it's deleted) then userinit.exe is not executed and the user is unable to log on. An active thread existing on bytes.com is here. And as you can see from that thread that to solve this problem requires much effort (atleast for a normal computer user).

Whether your system will crashes or not, depends only on how much your system is messed up. There are many more (inevident) cases which may arise and cause Windows PC to crash.

I reiterate, deleting such folders might cause probelms to non O/S applications only such as Windows update files, any other updates, and ofcourse users profile data.

And yes.. even if it works (as you have said) but it still would be a lot mess as non OS applications would be corrupted and what a user will do with a whole messed up system (except if he is a hacker and believes to crash system "JUST FOR FUN").
There may be alot of autoruns pointing to files which are deleted and that may increase startup time considerably
OR
There may be some AntiVirus files left in C:\Windows or C:\windows\syst em32 which may later cause AntiVirus program conflicts.
And so I dont prefer to do as you have advised to OP.


Hope this clears what I mean to say..........
AmbrNewlearner

[questionit]

AmberNewLearner 's comments are somewhat correct but consider this:

boot.ini, ntldr, NTDETECT.com are not external programs

These are hidden files so these can not be deleted with normal delete operation by the user who attemps to delete them either from Windows GUI or from Windows Cmd.

C:\Windows\syst em32\userinit.e xe -
This is inside Windows folder. Windows folder would be excluded from deletion as already said.

And you talked about Auto run or Auto startup. If you look at "Auto Startup" in Msconfig, there is not a single system file in the list. So thats not a problem, either.

Good indicator by Ambernewlearner anyway !

Qi

[AmberJain]

Hello,

@questionit ---->
Well, you have misinterpreted almost all my previous replies.......
Just try to read my previous replies carefully and then only reply. Your previous reply is an example of that you had not read my REPLIES #16 and #17 carefully.

boot.ini, ntldr, NTDETECT.com are not external programs


These are hidden files so these can not be deleted with normal delete operation by the user who attemps to delete them either from Windows GUI or from Windows Cmd.

.
Well, although these are hidden files but even layman(s) know how to unhide them (both using GUI and CUI). Even my sister (who is a biology student) knows to use:

del C:\*.* /AHS

And I have already said that- "Whether your system will crashes or not, depends only on how much your system is messed up". And if your XP installation is too old (probably years) then it is certainly a case that a normal computer user would have messed up with all his system settings (knowingly or unknowingly).

C:\Windows\syst em32\userinit.e xe -
This is inside Windows folder. Windows folder would be excluded from deletion as already said.

Ahh....What the heck..Read my previous reply carefully. I never said that userinit.exe would be deleted (even I have that commonsense).

I said that some program may add itself to HKLM\SOFTWARE\M icrosoft\Window s NT\CurrentVersi on\Winlogon\use rinit such that it is executed itself before the Windows Explorer user interface starts. e.g.

C:\ABC\XYZ\hello.exe ; c:\windows\system32\userinit.exe

And if this program hello.exe is not installed at [Program Files] and it is deleted (mind it that I am talking about deleting hello.exe and not userinit.exe, then userinit.exe will not be executed and Windows Explorer user interface will not start. The result would be that user will not be able to logon. For more details check out the links I posted in my previous reply.

And you talked about Auto run or Auto startup. If you look at "Auto Startup" in Msconfig, there is not a single system file in the list. So thats not a problem, either.

Huhh...My personal opinion in this matter is that msconfig is one of worst utility when it comes to displaying AutoStartup in Windows. It shows only 5 autoruns on my Windows XP system(Microsof t believes in advancements in technology by obscurity). I prefer Sysinternals Autoruns over all other silly utilities for configuring my AutoStarting files.


From now on I will not bother to read your replies (and then reply back) if you dont read my replies carefully. I have to simply reQUOTE my previous replies to clear what I mean.


Hope I am clear (if you read CAREFULLY)..... .
AmbrNewlearner

[questionit]

You said a layman known how to unhide files.
Even if a layman known how to unhide the files but did the questioner ever asked for an action that requires him to do such a thing?

My answer was simply in context of his scenario and not to answer your comments.

Daniel simply wants to clean up his drive and keep the O/S. Why then he would need to go through such a course to first bring all the hidden and non-hidden files up and then delete them.

He wants to clean up his drive and keep the O/S and the programs also!!!!!!

Therefore, i had suggested that he can delete all the rest of the files and folders and leave Windows folder and his system will be safe!!!

Files such as NTLDR, etc are hidden for a purpose and that purpose is it to keep them safe from both accidental or intentional deletion

And again, there is no other auto run file that any user can delete by just using delete command or the DOS command with parameters you've made.

I know you still have many things in your mind that starts up automatically such as Ms Office , Adobe Acrobat and many others...Again, this has nothing to do with O/S,, so let these files be zapped!

[NeoPa]

Qi,

It is not permissable when arguing to include abuse or ridicule on this site. I have edited your post in a way I VERY rarely do - to remove the insults. If you can't keep to the rules then I suggest you leave it out completely.

Administrator.

[NeoPa]

As far as your post is concerned (This is not as an Administrator but simply as someone who has some basic understanding of the fundamentals of Windows), I really feel you would be better advised not continuing to argue as I can only say that most of what you say is simply wrong.

Testing that a system actually boots after destroying the system as you suggested, is proof of nothing. It merely indicates that the fundamental problems you've introduced (or anyone following your recommended procedure) are not immediately visible.

Quite apart from the test you claim to have performed being done on a single PC (I presume) and not on thousands (so could hardly be considered representative) , simply starting a PC into a Windows logon prompt is clearly not a reasonable test for something as serious as this.

I don't see anyone who knows anything about Windows supporting your contention. Don't you feel somebody might, if you were correct as you say, and two other members were posting something that must be so so wrong (assuming your contention were not utter fallacy)?

My answer was simply in context of his scenario and not to answer your comments.

The point is, that even under such a restrictive definition, your answer is still very very wrong.

[questionit]

I standby with what i said before.

NeoPa has provided no proof whatsoever to nullify my suggestions, not a single !!!

Whatever is said is correct as already proved. you do Daniel a favour, bring him proof that doing what i have suggested is not correct.

I think this will be good to clear up the situation.

Even, missinglinq is against some of you guys' comments.

You said

Testing that a system actually boots after destroying the system...

Again, where did you get this from? Who said to destroy the system. I said delete the external apps and leave the system (O/S).
How strange, how you make things up so conviniently.


Secondly, where is it you found abuse and ridicule in my post. I challenge you to bring up single quote!!


What about

Ahh....What the heck..Read

by AmbrNewLearner


And lastly, when i said this test has been performed already, how you say i did it on only 1 PC? Again you make up things from no where
By the way, did you try it on a PC at all ?

These questions and comments for you.

Stang02GT did try to behave like you before but i silenced him because he was wrong and he has realized it, he never replied to my e-mail.

Very funny if you are thinking to ban my ID now,, so you are free to use your inequitable means to do so.

[Studlyami]

Well, after that post I'm going to have to chime in on this topic. When i first read the original responses I was in horror that someone would actually suggest to someone to just delete the folders from the C:/ except the windows and program files folders. This is a terrible idea to do to your computer. If the computer can boot into windows great, but you still have a huge pile of mess on your computer. You will have fragments in your registry and as you stated some of your device drivers might not work. I have deleted files required by my sound card (sound blaster audigy 2ZS) and it caused system lock ups and some of my programs would crash. Reinstalling the audio driver/files fixed this issue, but who knows how many files would be required to be reinstalled. The OS files might still be intact, but you have created an unpredictable, unstable, working environment. If I'm able to load windows, but I suffer from random freezes and have constant program crashes is the environment still useful? While this might be okay if your testing a system, or are curious what would happen, but to suggest such an action to another user, one who may not be that tech savvy seems careless. Also in your first post you didn't post any of the possible repercussions of what could happen by doing this. The better option is to start from scratch and reinstall the programs wanted, but you didn't even mention this in your first post. I know its a pain, but that's better than corrupting user files and programs.

[NeoPa]

I standby with what i said before.

NeoPa has provided no proof whatsoever to nullify my suggestions, not a single !!!

Qi,

I'm sorry you still see things that way.

I'm not too worried for anyone else now, as a number of us have posted clearly and sensibly as to why this is so obviously a very bad idea. The fact that you still can't see or understand that, or are simply unwilling ever to admit to being wrong, is really only a problem for you now. That sort of approach in life is sure to lead you into difficulties, which I take no joy from knowing, but there it is.

[AmberJain]

Hello,

@questionit ---> Although I said that I will not bother to reply to your posts, still I am posting again.......... this time I am not here to elaborate/explain what I have already said but for something else (I always got the help I needed from bytes.com and hence I have some responsibilitie s towards bytes.com and that is why I am posting).

NeoPa has provided no proof whatsoever to nullify my suggestions, not a single !!!

Whatever is said is correct as already proved. you do Daniel a favour, bring him proof that doing what i have suggested is not correct.

Well, NeoPa doesnot needs to provide any proof. He is one of most respected voice on bytes.com and so I dont think that you have any such right to demand a proof from NeoPa.

I think this will be good to clear up the situation.

No one (if I make it out correctly) now wishes to "clear up this situation". We all understand what others are speaking and so............

How strange, how you make things up so conviniently

Well, It's a secret of members of bytes.com (shhhh......mem bers, please dont share it in open here) ;)


And yes.....I remind you that Stang02GT is another respected voice on bytes.com.

:) :) :) :) :)
AmbrNewlearner