4.01 Compliance Help

**aljamala@gmail.com** · Jan 4 '07, 08:55 PM

Re: 4.01 Compliance Help

Martin Clark wrote:

aljamala@gmail. com wrote...
>

<img alt="Loading... Please wait."

>
Well, for informative alt text, that takes the biscuit!

So does your post!

**aljamala@gmail.com** · Jan 4 '07, 09:05 PM

Re: 4.01 Compliance Help

aljamala@gmail. com wrote:

Thanks to all who replied....that clarifies it for me! I was able to
get rid of those warnings.

I do have one other question that is related to this topic and I've run
into the problem a few times...I have a table that is displayed ot the
user using dynamic content..

strHTML = strHTML & "<td align='center' class='" & strClass & "'>" &
rs("rm_term_min ") & "</td>"
strHTML = strHTML & "<td align='center' class='" & strClass & "'>" &
rs("prog_freq" ) & "</td>"
strHTML = strHTML & "<td align='center' class='" & strClass & "'>" &
rs("prog_desc" ) & "</td>"

where the CSS class alternates between rows. However, as soon as I add
the doctype tag (seen below)....the styling is all gone. Does anyone
have an idea as to why that happens?

<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"
"http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/loose.dtd">

**Darin McGrew** · Jan 4 '07, 09:15 PM

Re: 4.01 Compliance Help

<aljamala@gmail .comwrote:

However, as soon as I add the doctype tag (seen below)....the styling
is all gone. Does anyone have an idea as to why that happens?

Without seeing the actual page, we can only guess. But my guess is that
your CSS is broken, and your doctype declaration triggers the browser's
standards mode (or "almost standards" mode). See
http://hsivonen.iki.fi/doctype/ for more info.
--
Darin McGrew, mcgrew@stanford alumni.org, http://www.rahul.net/mcgrew/
Web Design Group, darin@htmlhelp. com, http://www.HTMLHelp.com/

"I used to do lots of dumb things, but I turned my life around 360 degrees!"

**Darin McGrew** · Jan 4 '07, 09:15 PM

Re: 4.01 Compliance Help

aljamala@gmail. com wrote...

>><img alt="Loading... Please wait."

Martin Clark wrote:

>Well, for informative alt text, that takes the biscuit!

<aljamala@gmail .comwrote:

So does your post!

For information on how to write more appropriate ALT text, see

ALT texts in IMG

http://www.htmlhelp.com/feature/art3.htm

The Web Design Group's Feature Article, by Alan Flavell, discusses the proper use of ALT texts in IMGs.

--
Darin McGrew, mcgrew@stanford alumni.org, http://www.rahul.net/mcgrew/
Web Design Group, darin@htmlhelp. com, http://www.HTMLHelp.com/

"I used to do lots of dumb things, but I turned my life around 360 degrees!"

**Adrienne Boswell** · Jan 5 '07, 04:05 AM

Re: 4.01 Compliance Help

Gazing into my crystal ball I observed aljamala@gmail. com writing in
news:1167944257 .339717.83520@i 15g2000cwa.goog legroups.com:

>
aljamala@gmail. com wrote:

>Thanks to all who replied....that clarifies it for me! I was able to
>get rid of those warnings.

>
I do have one other question that is related to this topic and I've

run

into the problem a few times...I have a table that is displayed ot the
user using dynamic content..
>
strHTML = strHTML & "<td align='center' class='" & strClass & "'>" &
rs("rm_term_min ") & "</td>"
strHTML = strHTML & "<td align='center' class='" & strClass & "'>" &
rs("prog_freq" ) & "</td>"
strHTML = strHTML & "<td align='center' class='" & strClass & "'>" &
rs("prog_desc" ) & "</td>"
>
where the CSS class alternates between rows. However, as soon as I

add

the doctype tag (seen below)....the styling is all gone. Does anyone
have an idea as to why that happens?
>
><!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"
"http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/loose.dtd">
>

You would be better off doing something like:

<% while ...
i = i + 1
if i mod 2 = 0 then
rcolor = "class='colora' "
else
rcolor = "class='colorb' "
end if
strHTML = strHTML & "<tr " & rcolor & ">"
strHTML = strHTML & "<td>" & ....
%>

In the head:
<style type="text/css">
..colora {background-color: #fff; color: inherit;}
..colorb {background-color: #ADD8E6; color: inherit;}
td {text-align: center}
</style>

Actually, if you use this scheme all over the place, you could put the
colora and colorb classes in an external stylesheet.

--
Adrienne Boswell at Home
Arbpen Web Site Design Services

Arbpen Consulting

http://www.cavalcade-of-coding.info

Arbpen Consulting will help you harness valuable insights and translate them into tangible results by merging data and strategy.

Please respond to the group so others can share

**=?ISO-8859-1?Q?G=E9rard_Talbot?=** · Jan 5 '07, 07:05 AM

Re: 4.01 Compliance Help

aljamala@gmail. com wrote :

Jukka K. Korpela wrote:

>You still have wrong nesting, against the advice you got. Besides, you
>should have posted the _URL_ from the beginning and specified which software
>gave you the warning - surely not a validator, since such nesting errors are
>reportable markup _errors_.

>
Tidy plugin for Firefox is the validator I am using. As I already
mentioned, its an intranet site so which is why I havent posted the URL.

Then use version 0.8.3.4 and use the (true) SGML parser mode only. When
you get more accustomed to fixing markup errors (not just warnings),
then and only then will you be able to set it to "serial" (SGML parsing
and Tidy).

I assume here that you're using HTML Validator for Firefox:

http://users.skynet.be/mgueury/mozilla/preview_080.html

Gérard
--
remove blah to email me

**Jukka K. Korpela** · Jan 5 '07, 02:05 PM

Re: 4.01 Compliance Help

Scripsit Adrienne Boswell:

About the CSS side of the matter:

Using color: inherit is unsafe, because IE does not support the special
value inherit and would thus use the color value that is determined in the
cascade and might be, for example, the same as or very similar to the
background-color value. Moreover, even when the color is inherited, the
inherited value might come from another style sheet, beyond the author's
control. The only really safe way is to set the color property to an
explicit value.

It would be safer to use
..colora *
instead of
..colora
if you have set <tr class="colora"> , since otherwise you'd be setting the
properties for tr elements only, and who knows whether the th and td
elements inside them will inherit those properties? (Actually,
background-color is not inherited, though it might seem so since the initial
value is transparent.)

About the HTML and CSS side:

The class names "colora" and "colorb" are not descriptive of meaning or
structure, and I think "even" and "odd" would be better, referring to the
idea of alternating rows with (implicit) even and odd ordinal numbers.

Actually you don't need both of them, since you could set the values for all
rows, then different values for "even" rows. This would save some markup.

--
Jukka K. Korpela ("Yucca")

http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

**aljamala@gmail.com** · Jan 5 '07, 10:15 PM

Re: 4.01 Compliance Help

Jukka K. Korpela wrote:

About the CSS side of the matter:
>
Using color: inherit is unsafe, because IE does not support the special
value inherit and would thus use the color value that is determined in the
cascade and might be, for example, the same as or very similar to the
background-color value. Moreover, even when the color is inherited, the
inherited value might come from another style sheet, beyond the author's
control. The only really safe way is to set the color property to an
explicit value.
>
It would be safer to use
.colora *
instead of
.colora
if you have set <tr class="colora"> , since otherwise you'd be setting the
properties for tr elements only, and who knows whether the th and td
elements inside them will inherit those properties? (Actually,
background-color is not inherited, though it might seem so since the initial
value is transparent.)
>
About the HTML and CSS side:
>
The class names "colora" and "colorb" are not descriptive of meaning or
structure, and I think "even" and "odd" would be better, referring to the
idea of alternating rows with (implicit) even and odd ordinal numbers.
>
Actually you don't need both of them, since you could set the values for all
rows, then different values for "even" rows. This would save some markup.
>

I'll have to look into that when I get the chance...honest ly this
application is old, with dirty classic ASP code....I dont see it being
supported much longer as we slowly shift to .NET

I do have another question though about 4.01 compliance...(c ode snippet
below)

I get this error:line 44 column 1 - Warning: <trisn't allowed in
<bodyelements
and it highlights: <body style="margin: 0;" onload="preload Images();">

<body style="margin: 0;" onload="preload Images();">
<table border="0" cellPadding="5" cellSpacing="0" width="100%">
<tr vAlign="top">

<td valign="bottom" style="white-space: nowrap">
<img src="../images/citlogo_small.g if" width="92" height="45"
alt="">
<img src="../images/citlogotri2.gif " WIDTH="150" HEIGHT="41"
alt=""></td>

<td width="100%" align="right">
<span id="wait" style="display: none;"><img
src="../../common/images/gradient.gif" style="vertical-align: middle;"
alt=""></span>

<a
HREF="rptPDF.as p?ENC_x4iPsfyRX/CG0qlOztqO6p/YvkxtDQjhrTHc3d cQgAOW/G4v+sAAPp90G8H5 YPli5EnQ9PaY7eE DM8Fs9lKWBwMIDF EaghLg2WkKwBIvz tbwd3IrOST+wovD iE5FVXq3Xcj1B9m VGII="
target="_blank" onfocus="blur() ;"
ONMOUSEOVER="ch angeImages('rpt _printer_icon',
'/common/images/rpt_printer_ico n-over.gif'); return true;"
ONMOUSEOUT="cha ngeImages('rpt_ printer_icon',
'/common/images/rpt_printer_ico n.gif'); return true;">
<img alt="Printer-friendly format" NAME="rpt_print er_icon"
SRC="/common/images/rpt_printer_ico n.gif" WIDTH="25" HEIGHT="25"
BORDER="0"></a>

<a
HREF="/common/report/report_csv.asp? ENC_x4iPsfyRX/CG0qlOztqO6p/YvkxtDQjhrTHc3d cQgAOW/G4v+sAAPp90G8H5 YPli5EnQ9PaY7eE DM8Fs9lKWBwMIDF EaghLg2WkKwBIvz tbwd3IrOST+wovD iE5FVXq3Xcj1B9m VGII="
onfocus="blur() ;" ONMOUSEOVER="ch angeImages('rpt _excel_icon',
'/common/images/rpt_excel_icon-over.gif'); return true;"
ONMOUSEOUT="cha ngeImages('rpt_ excel_icon',
'/common/images/rpt_excel_icon. gif'); return true;">
<img alt="Save comma-delimited file" NAME="rpt_excel _icon"
SRC="/common/images/rpt_excel_icon. gif" WIDTH="25" HEIGHT="25"
BORDER="0"></a>

</td>

</tr>
<tr><td colspan="3">
<table border="0" cellPadding="0" cellSpacing="0" width="100%">
<tr bgcolor="#33669 9">
<td><img src="../images/curve_left.gif" WIDTH="3" HEIGHT="10"
alt=""></td>
<td><img src="../../common/images/spacer.gif" height="10" width="1"
alt=""></td>

<td align="right">< img src="../images/curve_right.gif " WIDTH="3"
HEIGHT="10" alt=""></td>
</tr>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
</table>
<center><span class="title">A sset Summary Detail</span></center>

**Jukka K. Korpela** · Jan 5 '07, 10:35 PM

Re: 4.01 Compliance Help

Scripsit aljamala@gmail. com:

I'll have to look into that when I get the chance...

You didn't have to quote my entire message to say that, did you? I wonder
whether it was really useful to say that at all, except perhaps as a warning
that you're not taking the discussion and suggestions very seriously.

I do have another question though about 4.01 compliance...(c ode
snippet below)

You're supposed to post URLs of problem pages, if you have WWW-related
questions, and not to post here at all if you don't. Hang around for a while
and you'll understand why. You know, for one thing, when you extract a code
snippet, markup bugs often run and hide elsewhere.

I even took the trouble of constructing a page that contains your code
snippet, preceded by a minimal initial part. Guess what? It validates. So
the snippet you posted was simply a _wrong_ snippet (or you're using a very
faulty checker to check your code).

--
Jukka K. Korpela ("Yucca")

http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

**TreeNet Webmaster** · Jan 7 '07, 04:35 AM

Re: 4.01 Compliance Help

In article <Z%cnh.19413$oG 4.12798@reader1 .news.saunalaht i.fi>,
jkorpela@cs.tut .fi says...

Scripsit aljamala@gmail. com:
>

Tidy plugin for Firefox is the validator I am using.

>
It is not a validator.

Incorrect.
"Tidy Plugin to Firefox" != "tidy the application"

The plugin does both validation (using the SGML W3C validator) then the
actual tidy application checks if the code validates.

AJ

**=?ISO-8859-15?Q?G=E9rard_Talbot?=** · Jan 7 '07, 07:25 AM

Re: 4.01 Compliance Help

TreeNet Webmaster wrote :

In article <Z%cnh.19413$oG 4.12798@reader1 .news.saunalaht i.fi>,
jkorpela@cs.tut .fi says...

>Scripsit aljamala@gmail. com:
>>

>>Tidy plugin for Firefox is the validator I am using.

>It is not a validator.

>
Incorrect.
"Tidy Plugin to Firefox" != "tidy the application"
>
The plugin does both validation (using the SGML W3C validator) then the
actual tidy application checks if the code validates.
>
AJ

It all depends on which version you have installed and then which
setting (SGML parser, Tidy or serial) you have chosen in the beta 0.8.x
version.

The plugin (in the latest 0.8.3.4 version) does not do both validation
in its default setting. And again: there are 2 versions available. The
stable 0.7.9.5 only does some cleaning of the markup code.

Gérard
--
remove blah to email me

**aljamala@gmail.com** · Jan 10 '07, 10:15 PM

Re: 4.01 Compliance Help

Gérard Talbot wrote:

TreeNet Webmaster wrote :

In article <Z%cnh.19413$oG 4.12798@reader1 .news.saunalaht i.fi>,
jkorpela@cs.tut .fi says...

Scripsit aljamala@gmail. com:
>
>Tidy plugin for Firefox is the validator I am using.
It is not a validator.

It all depends on which version you have installed and then which
setting (SGML parser, Tidy or serial) you have chosen in the beta 0.8.x
version.
>
The plugin (in the latest 0.8.3.4 version) does not do both validation
in its default setting. And again: there are 2 versions available. The
stable 0.7.9.5 only does some cleaning of the markup code.
>

It does validate by showing me warnings/errors and once I clear all of
them [errors] and then paste my source

>You're supposed to post URLs of problem pages, if you have WWW-related
>questions, and not to post here at all if you don't. Hang around for a while
>and you'll understand why. You know, for one thing, when you extract a code
>snippet, markup bugs often run and hide elsewhere.

Yes, I am learning that as I go along, because a line might be
highlighted, but the problem is 100s of lines down, but I am trying my
best, sorry if it doesn't satisfy your needs, but you don't have to
answer instead of just flaming me over & over.

I have the following header with errors (see under <Source>), most
obvious problem is ...

<!!START!!>
<td width="100%" background="../images/bar_sliver.gif" >
<form name="frmCurren cy" action="" method="post">
<table width="100%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" border="0">

<!!END!!>
</td>
</form>
</tr>
</table>
</td>
<td><img alt="" src="../images/bar_right.gif" width="6"
height="24"></td>
</tr>
</table>

Once I change it to
</td>
</tr>
</table>
</form>
</td>

The header bar (with text) renders incorrectly in IE but OK in
Firefox...howev er, if there is no text in the header bar (cell), the
bar renders correctly under both browsers. Sounds quirky and I was
wondering has experienced or ran across such a problem?

Thanks,

<Source>

<body onload="preload Images();">

<table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" >
<tr>
<td><img alt="" src="../images/spacer.gif" width="5"
height="65"></td>

<td colspan="2"><im g alt="" src="../images/logo_noanim.gif "
width="500" height="67"></td>
<td class="bg" width="100%"></td>
<td bgcolor="dddddd "><a href="http://www.cit.com"><i mg alt=""
border="0" src="../images/right_logo.gif" WIDTH="225"
HEIGHT="67"></a></td>
<td><img alt="" src="../images/spacer.gif" width="6"
height="65"></td>
</tr>
</table>
<table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" >
<tr>
<td><img alt="" src="../images/bar_left.gif" width="14"
height="24"></td>
<td width="100%" background="../images/bar_sliver.gif" >

<form name="frmCurren cy" action="" method="post">
<table width="100%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" border="0">
<tr>
<td nowrap>

<div class="portfoli o">     DEA LER
PORTFOLIO</div>
</td>
<td valign="bottom" align=right>

</td>
<td align="right" valign="top" nowrap>

<div class="Bar">
<a href="../home.asp" onmouseover="ch angeImages('btn Home',
'../images/home-over.gif'); return true;"
onmouseout="cha ngeImages('btnH ome', '../images/home.gif'); return
true;"><img alt="Return to the DigitalEdge Portfolio Summary"
name="btnHome" src="../images/home.gif" width="19" height="19"
border="0" align="bottom"> </a></td>

</div>
</td>
</form>
</tr>
</table>
</td>
<td><img alt="" src="../images/bar_right.gif" width="6"
height="24"></td>

</tr>
</table>

**John Hosking** · Jan 11 '07, 04:45 AM

Re: 4.01 Compliance Help

aljamala@gmail. com wrote:

Gérard Talbot wrote:
>

>>It all depends on which version you have installed and then which
>>setting (SGML parser, Tidy or serial) you have chosen in the beta 0.8.x
>>version.
>>
>>The plugin (in the latest 0.8.3.4 version) does not do both validation
>>in its default setting. And again: there are 2 versions available. The
>>stable 0.7.9.5 only does some cleaning of the markup code.
>>

>
It does validate by showing me warnings/errors and once I clear all of
them [errors] and then paste my source
>

>>You're supposed to post URLs of problem pages, if you have WWW-related
>>questions, and not to post here at all if you don't. Hang around for a while
>>and you'll understand why. You know, for one thing, when you extract a code
>>snippet, markup bugs often run and hide elsewhere.

>
>
Yes, I am learning that as I go along, because a line might be
highlighted, but the problem is 100s of lines down, but I am trying my
best, sorry if it doesn't satisfy your needs,

They're *your* needs, brother; *you're* the one who needs the help.

but you don't have to
answer instead of just flaming me over & over.

Trust me, you have not been flamed. Gérard has certainly not flamed you,
and definitely not "over and over". In fact, this was only his second
reply to you. Both messages were to the point. Sorry if it doesn't
satisfy your needs.

What he says is true, friend; intranet pages are off-topic here. He (and
others who've mentioned it) meant to help you (and the rest of the
group) by explaining. If you supply no URL, you need expect no help.
You've gotten some *anyway*. Celebrate (and review) that!

>
I have the following header with errors (see under <Source>), most
obvious problem is ...

What do you mean by header? What errors? Etc.

>
<!!START!!>

What is this supposed to be? It is not HTML, if that's what you think.
It'd be sure to cause an error in a validator. A comment in HTML is
formed as .

[unhelpful code-like sequences snipped]

>
<Source>

This is the place where you mention the URL, not type "<Source>". Or are
you trying to tell a browser where the source starts with some made-up
element?

[some code snipped here]
[some code painstakingly reformatted and edited slightly below]
>
<table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" >
<tr>
<td><img alt="" src="../images/bar_left.gif" width="14" height="24"></td>
<td width="100%" background="../images/bar_sliver.gif" >
>
<form name="frmCurren cy" action="" method="post">
<table width="100%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" border="0">
<tr>
<td nowrap>
<div class="portfoli o">     DEA LER PORTFOLIO</div>
</td>
<td valign="bottom" align=right></td>
<td align="right" valign="top" nowrap>
<div class="Bar"><a href=...><img ...></a></td 
</div>
</td>
</form 
</tr>
</table>
</td>
<td><img alt="" src="../images/bar_right.gif" width="6" height="24"></td>
</tr>
</table>
>

Your coding (nesting) is still badly mangled. A real validator would
have told you that. Looking at it by hand takes time, which is why
reasonable people won't do it for you (I did, yes, but don't go by
that...). Psot the code on a server, feed the URL to a validator, fix
what you can, then, if you *still* need help, come back by with the URL.

Good luck.
--
John

**aljamala@gmail.com** · Jan 11 '07, 03:55 PM

Re: 4.01 Compliance Help

John Hosking wrote:

>
Trust me, you have not been flamed. Gérard has certainly not flamed you,
and definitely not "over and over". In fact, this was only his second
reply to you. Both messages were to the point. Sorry if it doesn't
satisfy your needs.

I was talking about Jakka not Gerard

>
>
What do you mean by header? What errors? Etc.
>

a page header....the top of the page, like where it says google groups
at the top of the page

<!!START!!>

>
What is this supposed to be? It is not HTML, if that's what you think.
It'd be sure to cause an error in a validator. A comment in HTML is
formed as .
>

I know that, I added that into the post to show where the code starts

>

>
This is the place where you mention the URL, not type "<Source>". Or are
you trying to tell a browser where the source starts with some made-up
element?

I made it up for the readers not the browser, its not actually in my
source code

Your coding (nesting) is still badly mangled. A real validator would
have told you that. Looking at it by hand takes time, which is why
reasonable people won't do it for you (I did, yes, but don't go by
that...). Psot the code on a server, feed the URL to a validator, fix
what you can, then, if you *still* need help, come back by with the URL.

Good luck.

duly noted and thanks

**aljamala@gmail.com** · Jan 11 '07, 08:55 PM

Re: 4.01 Compliance Help

John Hosking wrote:

Your coding (nesting) is still badly mangled. A real validator would
have told you that. Looking at it by hand takes time, which is why
reasonable people won't do it for you (I did, yes, but don't go by
that...). Psot the code on a server, feed the URL to a validator, fix
what you can, then, if you *still* need help, come back by with the URL.

I tried, I dont know if this will help at all, its geocities so its
really limited, but free!

Yahoo | Mail, Weather, Search, Politics, News, Finance, Sports & Videos

http://www.geocities.com/aal_jamal/hometest.html

Latest news coverage, email, free stock quotes, live scores and video are just the beginning. Discover more every day at Yahoo!

View this page in IE and Firefox and you will notice a difference in
the size of that silver bar containing "dealer portfolio"...do es anyone
know why that might happen? thats basically my question, on different
browsers, it is getting rendered differently. If the link doesn't
help, then I apologize and you can disregard my message. It's just
that this is making my head spin especially since it is the last thing
I need to fix and its pesky.

4.01 Compliance Help

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment