Access vs SQL

[lgbjr]

Re: Access vs SQL

Cor,

I think this is a symantics issue. I will agree that throughout the user
populance, many people refer to Access, MS Access, an Access DB, etc. as
being a database. While this has been / is acceptable for most people, I
believe what TC said is technically correct.

Most people open MS Access, create some tables, queries, forms, modules,
etc. and the language used to drive the front end is VBA (forms, modules,
etc). Most are unaware that the actual DB engine is not Access (as there's
no such thing), it's Jet (by default).

After loading MSDE, since it doesn't have a GUI, I am using MS Access, via
an ADP project, to make modifications to the MSDE DB (SQL Server DB). If MS
Access were, as you're implying, a database engine, you wouldn't be able to
change database engines in the product. Therefore, MS Access should really
be thought about and talked about as an IDE that supports several DB engines
(similar to VS.NET being an IDE that supports several programming
languages).

Again, I believe this is a symantics issue. Everyone knows/knew what I was
talking about, but, from now on, when I catch myself refering to an Access
DB, I'll replace that with a Jet DB with a front end built in MS Access, or
whatever DB engine I happen to be using.

Of course, if I talk to my clients about a Jet DB, I'll just get blank
stares and questions about what happened to the Access DB. ;-)

Cheers
Lee


"Cor Ligthert" <notmyfirstname @planet.nl> wrote in message
news:O7KASNaPFH A.164@TK2MSFTNG P12.phx.gbl...[color=blue]
> lgbjr,
>[color=green]
>>And I also agree that MS Access as a product is not a database, it's an
>>IDE for developing a DB front end.[/color]
>
> As I wrote in my previous message this is not true, I have the idea you
> are talking about the MS office Access product. You can create an access
> database using ADO in your program as a part of your development.
>
> Cor
>[/color]

[Cor Ligthert]

Re: Access vs SQL

Lee,

An answer without words,

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;823927

:-)))

Cor

[aatcbbtccctc@yahoo.com]

Re: Access vs SQL

Not so, Cor.

MS Access does not contain any of the base technologies for creating &
managing tables & indexes; parsing, optimizing & executing SQL; or any
of the other things that database products have to do.

Those technologies all reside in a completely seperate product, MS Jet.
Access uses the Jet API to create & maintain tables & indexes, execute
SQL, and so on.

Access does ask Jet (via a Jet API) to create, within the MDB file,
some containers for Access to store its own things (forms, reports
etc.) - but that does not make Access, a database.

I suspect your mistake is in believing that an MDB file is an *Access*
file. It is not - it is a *Jet* file, in which Access is able to store
its own things (in addition to the standard Jet things).

A VB program can use a Jet MDB file for database storage; but VB is not
Access, and does not require Access to be present in any way, shape or
form.

HTH
TC

[aatcbbtccctc@yahoo.com]

Re: Access vs SQL


Cor Ligthert wrote:
[color=blue]
> You can create an access database using
> ADO in your program as a part of your
> development.[/color]


That is not an Access database. It is a Jet database. It does not
require MS Access to be present (before, now, or in the future) on the
PC.

HTH,
TC

[aatcbbtccctc@yahoo.com]

Re: Access vs SQL

Microsoft's use of the term "Access Database" in that article, is
incorrect.

If I happened to mis-spell my own name, that would not make the
mis-spelling correct!

HTH,
TC

[Cor Ligthert]

Re: Access vs SQL

TC,

You make in my opinion a mistake what is a database. For a database is not
even SQL required (In the last case we are mostly talking about a relational
database). It only needs that the data is accessable in a random way and
that there is an ability to replace parts of the data when there is an
update, delete or insert.

Cor

[Richard Myers]

Re: Access vs SQL

Cor you're wrong.
TC you're being pedantic.
I hope neither of you are customer facing for your respective firms.

Richard





<aatcbbtccctc@y ahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1113193415 .690790.115480@ g14g2000cwa.goo glegroups.com.. .[color=blue]
>
> Cor Ligthert wrote:
>[color=green]
> > You can create an access database using
> > ADO in your program as a part of your
> > development.[/color]
>
>
> That is not an Access database. It is a Jet database. It does not
> require MS Access to be present (before, now, or in the future) on the
> PC.
>
> HTH,
> TC
>[/color]

[Cor Ligthert]

Re: Access vs SQL

Richard,
[color=blue]
>Cor Ligthert wrote:[/color]
[color=blue][color=green]
>> You can create an access database using
> >ADO in your program as a part of your
> >development.[/color][/color]
[color=blue]
> Cor you're wrong.
> TC you're being pedantic.
> I hope neither of you are customer facing for your respective firms.
>[/color]

Will you explain what is wrong in my statement?

Cor

[Richard Myers]

Re: Access vs SQL

JT already has.


"Cor Ligthert" <notmyfirstname @planet.nl> wrote in message
news:u50JodmPFH A.2136@TK2MSFTN GP14.phx.gbl...[color=blue]
> Richard,
>[color=green]
> >Cor Ligthert wrote:[/color]
>[color=green][color=darkred]
> >> You can create an access database using
> > >ADO in your program as a part of your
> > >development.[/color][/color]
>[color=green]
> > Cor you're wrong.
> > TC you're being pedantic.
> > I hope neither of you are customer facing for your respective firms.
> >[/color]
>
> Will you explain what is wrong in my statement?
>
> Cor
>
>[/color]

[aatcbbtccctc@yahoo.com]

Re: Access vs SQL


Richard Myers wrote:
[color=blue]
> I hope neither of you are customer facing for your respective firms.[/color]


What an arrogant comment. This is a technical discussion forum, not a
shop front counter. I believe that technical accuracy is important in a
technical forum. You obviousy disagree. I leave readers to judge for
themselves.

Goodbye.

TC

[aatcbbtccctc@yahoo.com]

Re: Access vs SQL

You miss my point as to which components perform what tasks.

I don't intend to comment further.

Cheers,
TC

[Cor Ligthert]

Re: Access vs SQL

Richard,

No he did not on my question too you to explain why you wrote that this
statement from me is not true.
[color=blue][color=green]
>> You can create an access database using
> >ADO in your program as a part of your
> >development.[/color][/color]

At least you should tell why?

Cor

[Cor Ligthert]

Re: Access vs SQL

TC,

Sorry, your points sounds for me as splitting hairs.

Which sounds for me the same as if you want to tell that somebody born in
the US is not an American but an USan and somebody born in the EU is not
an European but an EUan.

Everybody visiting this newsgroups knows what is meant (and use that in
relation) by the Access database and are in the same way telling about MS
Access that it is an application.

Just my thought,

Cor

[Richard Myers]

Re: Access vs SQL


"Cor Ligthert" <notmyfirstname @planet.nl> wrote in message
news:OiLQMxmPFH A.2584@TK2MSFTN GP15.phx.gbl...[color=blue]
> Richard,
>
> No he did not on my question too you to explain why you wrote that this
> statement from me is not true.
>[color=green][color=darkred]
> >> You can create an access database using
> > >ADO in your program as a part of your
> > >development.[/color][/color]
>
> At least you should tell why?[/color]

Nope. Im currently eating ice cream with a fork which seems much more
interesting than continuing with this thread.
If you dont get it then thats fine, i really dont care either way. Check
out MSDN or alternatively try Access Help Files.

Richard

[Paul Clement]

Re: Access vs SQL

On 10 Apr 2005 18:58:31 -0700, aatcbbtccctc@ya hoo.com wrote:

¤ Not so, Cor.
¤
¤ MS Access does not contain any of the base technologies for creating &
¤ managing tables & indexes; parsing, optimizing & executing SQL; or any
¤ of the other things that database products have to do.
¤
¤ Those technologies all reside in a completely seperate product, MS Jet.
¤ Access uses the Jet API to create & maintain tables & indexes, execute
¤ SQL, and so on.
¤

This is incorrect.

I'm not sure why you're attempting to separate Jet from Microsoft Access. Each version of Microsoft
Access is actually hard-wired for a specific version of Jet and the functionality is essentially
integrated. You can also use DAO, ADO etc (independently) to work with an Access database directly
or via OLEDB or ODBC drivers but there isn't the same level of support as when using the Microsoft
Access application.

¤ Access does ask Jet (via a Jet API) to create, within the MDB file,
¤ some containers for Access to store its own things (forms, reports
¤ etc.) - but that does not make Access, a database.
¤

Huh?

¤ I suspect your mistake is in believing that an MDB file is an *Access*
¤ file. It is not - it is a *Jet* file, in which Access is able to store
¤ its own things (in addition to the standard Jet things).
¤

Baloney. It can contain data, code and database related objects that are native to the Microsoft
Access application. An MDB file *is* an Access database.

¤ A VB program can use a Jet MDB file for database storage; but VB is not
¤ Access, and does not require Access to be present in any way, shape or
¤ form.

That is, unless you attempt to use functionality that is not supported by Jet, but is only available
through the Microsoft Access application.


Paul
~~~~
Microsoft MVP (Visual Basic)