target="_blank" with xHTML

**Matthias Gutfeldt** · Jul 20 '05, 05:48 PM

Re: target="_b lank" with xHTML

St. Rechsteiner wrote:[color=blue]
> Hi
>
> How i made the same effect in xHTML like the - target="_blank" - Tag
> in HTML 4.01?[/color]

You don't. Use HTML4.01 if you need _blank.

Matthias

**Spartanicus** · Jul 20 '05, 05:48 PM

Re: target="_b lank" with xHTML

schule@macprime .ch (St. Rechsteiner) wrote:
[color=blue]
>target="_blank "[/color]

Stop trying to mess with a user's UI.
[color=blue]
>Tag[/color]

Attribute

--
Spartanicus

**Owen Jacobson** · Jul 20 '05, 05:48 PM

Re: target="_b lank" with xHTML

On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:37:55 +0100, Matthias Gutfeldt wrote:
[color=blue]
> St. Rechsteiner wrote:[color=green]
>> How i made the same effect in xHTML like the - target="_blank" - Tag
>> in HTML 4.01?[/color]
>
> You don't. Use HTML4.01 if you need _blank.[/color]

You misspelled "a transitional DOCTYPE". HTH, etc. Or, possibly, you
misspelled "don't".

--
Some say the Wired doesn't have political borders like the real world,
but there are far too many nonsense-spouting anarchists or idiots who
think that pranks are a revolution.

**Kris** · Jul 20 '05, 05:48 PM

Re: target="_b lank" with xHTML

In article <897f80d9.04022 32318.65a72a06@ posting.google. com>,
schule@macprime .ch (St. Rechsteiner) wrote:
[color=blue]
> How i made the same effect in xHTML like the - target="_blank" - Tag
> in HTML 4.01?[/color]

Attribute. It is allowed in XHTML1.0 Transitional. Author that if you
cannot let go of this 'demon from the old world'. Others will undoubtly
state why it is what it is.
[color=blue]
> I will use it with xHTML and CSS ...[/color]

If you 'will', then there is not much sense trying to convert you, sadly.
[color=blue]
> but the validator say's to me,
> that this tag wasn't valid for xHTML! ... Why? Is there no "same
> effect"-Tag in xHTML?[/color]

There are no effect tags in HTML. They were deprecated when the Flash
standard came out.

--
Kris
<kristiaan@xs4a ll.netherlands> (nl)
<http://www.cinnamon.nl/>

**Steve Pugh** · Jul 20 '05, 05:48 PM

Re: target="_b lank" with xHTML

schule@macprime .ch (St. Rechsteiner) wrote:
[color=blue]
>How i made the same effect in xHTML like the - target="_blank" - Tag[/color]

It's an attribute, not a tag.
[color=blue]
>in HTML 4.01?[/color]

The same way you do in HTML 4.01.

XHTML 1.0 and HTML 4.01 are identical - in both of them the target
attribute exists only in the Transitional forms.

So I'm guessing that you're jumping from HTML 4.01 Transitional to
XHTML 1.0 Strict. Any reason why?
[color=blue]
>I will use it with xHTML and CSS ... but the validator say's to me,
>that this tag wasn't valid for xHTML! ... Why?[/color]

Same reason that it's not in HTML 4.01 - anything to do with opening
new windows or frames is against the spirit of the Strict versions of
(X)HTML.

So in order of preference:
1. Stop trying to force a new window on your users, if they want a new
window they can open one themselves
2. Use a Transitional DTD instead
3. Use JavaScript

Steve

--
"My theories appal you, my heresies outrage you,
I never answer letters and you don't like my tie." - The Doctor

Steve Pugh <steve@pugh.net > <http://steve.pugh.net/>

**Karl Core** · Jul 20 '05, 05:49 PM

Re: target="_b lank" with xHTML

"St. Rechsteiner" <schule@macprim e.ch> wrote in message
news:897f80d9.0 402232318.65a72 a06@posting.goo gle.com...[color=blue]
> Hi
>
> How i made the same effect in xHTML like the - target="_blank" - Tag
> in HTML 4.01?
>[/color]

Why? You wanna create a site that confuses your visitors?

From a usability study by Stanford University - "Users became reliably
confused when links opened new windows"

--

Karl Groves

karlcore.com

http://www.karlcore.com

karlcore.com

**Matthias Gutfeldt** · Jul 20 '05, 05:49 PM

Re: target="_b lank" with xHTML

Owen Jacobson wrote:[color=blue]
> On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:37:55 +0100, Matthias Gutfeldt wrote:
>
>[color=green]
>>St. Rechsteiner wrote:
>>[color=darkred]
>>>How i made the same effect in xHTML like the - target="_blank" - Tag
>>>in HTML 4.01?[/color]
>>
>>You don't. Use HTML4.01 if you need _blank.[/color]
>
>
> You misspelled "a transitional DOCTYPE". HTH, etc. Or, possibly, you
> misspelled "don't".[/color]

Err, nope, I didn't misspell anything. I just didn't quite think it through.

Matthias

**Alan J. Flavell** · Jul 20 '05, 05:49 PM

Re: target="_b lank" with xHTML

On Tue, 24 Feb 2004, Spartanicus wrote:
[color=blue]
> schule@macprime .ch (St. Rechsteiner) wrote:
>[color=green]
> >target="_blank "[/color]
>
> Stop trying to mess with a user's UI.
>[color=green]
> >Tag[/color]
>
> Attribute[/color]

http://www.flightlab.com/~joe/sgml/faq-not.txt part 5. SCNR.

**Spartanicus** · Jul 20 '05, 05:49 PM

Re: target="_b lank" with xHTML

"Alan J. Flavell" <flavell@ph.gla .ac.uk> wrote:
[color=blue][color=green][color=darkred]
>> >Tag[/color]
>>
>> Attribute[/color]
>
>http://www.flightlab.com/~joe/sgml/faq-not.txt part 5. SCNR.[/color]

:)

--
Spartanicus

**Andrew Thompson** · Jul 20 '05, 05:49 PM

Re: target="_b lank" with xHTML

Karl Core wrote:[color=blue]
> "St. Rechsteiner" ...[/color]
....[color=blue][color=green]
>> How i made the same effect in xHTML like the - target="_blank" - Tag
>> in HTML 4.01?[/color][/color]
....[color=blue]
> Why? You wanna create a site that confuses your visitors?
>
> From a usability study by Stanford University - "Users became reliably
> confused when links opened new windows"[/color]

You got a link for that Karl?

I got curious after hearing it for the umpteenth
time and went searching. I found this..

http://www-nlp.stanford.edu/~manning/papers/ach-allc2000.doc

While this document mentions useability
and (separately) 'Windows' and 'confuse',
it does not have that exact quote, or
anything I could see that might mean the
same..

( I am in the process of stripping frames and
other such usability barriers from my sites, it
would just be nice to be able to point to a
study that actually supports the expenditure
of effort. And to point others to. )

--
Andrew Thompson
* http://www.PhySci.org/ Open-source software suite
* http://www.PhySci.org/codes/ Web & IT Help
* http://www.1point1C.org/ Science & Technology

**Martin Doering** · Jul 20 '05, 05:49 PM

Re: target="_b lank" with xHTML

On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:53:00 +0000, Spartanicus <me@privacy.net >
wrote:
[color=blue]
>schule@macprim e.ch (St. Rechsteiner) wrote:
>[color=green]
>>target="_blan k"[/color]
>
>Stop trying to mess with a user's UI.[/color]

To open a second window can be of much use. I am using it to open a
help for the actual running web application. I don't want to destroy
the original form, while using the help.

--
Martin

**Spartanicus** · Jul 20 '05, 05:49 PM

Re: target="_b lank" with xHTML

Martin Doering <doeringm@gmx.d e> wrote:
[color=blue][color=green][color=darkred]
>>>target="_bla nk"[/color]
>>
>>Stop trying to mess with a user's UI.[/color]
>
>To open a second window can be of much use. I am using it to open a
>help for the actual running web application. I don't want to destroy
>the original form, while using the help.[/color]

1) It's not about what you want, or what you think a user wants, users
are perfectly capable of making these decisions themselves. Opening new
windows is part of the browser's UI, it's not for authors to attempt to
mess with a UA's UI.
2) target="_blank" does not open a popup (typically smaller than the
original window) that appears on top of the existing window, it opens a
new window that usually will cover the original window completely.

--
Spartanicus

**Beauregard T. Shagnasty** · Jul 20 '05, 05:49 PM

Re: target="_b lank" with xHTML

Quoth the raven named Martin Doering:
[color=blue]
> On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:53:00 +0000, Spartanicus <me@privacy.net >
> wrote:
>[color=green]
>> schule@macprime .ch (St. Rechsteiner) wrote:
>>[color=darkred]
>>> target="_blank"[/color]
>>
>> Stop trying to mess with a user's UI.[/color]
>
> To open a second window can be of much use. I am using it to open a
> help for the actual running web application. I don't want to
> destroy the original form, while using the help.[/color]

The main problem with opening new windows occurs with visitors who
have small monitors and low resolution who tend to surf with the
browser maximized.

Your new window will completely overlay the original window containing
the form. It will also not have a functioning Back button. The
visitor doesn't realize there is a new window, and can't see the
original. So... they will probably just type some other URL, or go
back to their search engine. They will probably only discover your
original window when they decide to end their surfing session.

--
-bts
-This space intentionally left blank.

DU · Jul 20 '05, 05:49 PM

Re: target="_b lank" with xHTML

Martin Doering wrote:
[color=blue]
> On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 08:53:00 +0000, Spartanicus <me@privacy.net >
> wrote:
>
>[color=green]
>>schule@macpri me.ch (St. Rechsteiner) wrote:
>>
>>[color=darkred]
>>>target="_bla nk"[/color]
>>
>>Stop trying to mess with a user's UI.[/color]
>
>
> To open a second window can be of much use. I am using it to open a
> help for the actual running web application. I don't want to destroy
> the original form, while using the help.
>
> --
> Martin[/color]

Then at the very least follow the WAI recommendations on this by coding
the title attribute and by adding an icon clearly notifying the user
that clicking the link will open the referenced resource in a new,
separate window.
Don't interfere with users who will want to open such referenced
resource in a tab or in the same window. Let the users be in control of
the way such link can open the referenced resource. Users already have
all the settings, prefs, contextmenu commands to do such choice.

You can propose a scenario (open in a new window, reusable or not,
recyclable or not) but you should not force it by interfering with other
possible ways which may better fit the user.

DU

target="_blank" with xHTML

target="_blank" with xHTML

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