Simple fix..validation errors at W3C...

[Brandon]

I am an amateur working on a first site, I have settled on using FP 2002 for
now. My current page is up and live, but I have two errors that I cant seem
to get rid of ...

Line 29, column 6: duplicate specification of attribute "STYLE"
style="border: 1px solid #00F;width: 750px; height: 690px;"


Line 154, column 46: there is no attribute "BORDERCOLO R"
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" bordercolor="#0 000FF" width="650"

You have used the attribute named above in your document, but the document
type you are using does not support that attribute for this element. This
error is often caused by incorrect use of the "Strict" document type with a
document that uses frames (e.g. you must use the "Transition al" document
type to get the "target" attribute), or by using vendor proprietary
extensions such as "marginheig ht" (this is usually fixed by using CSS to
achieve the desired effect instead).

This error may also result if the element itself is not supported in the
document type you are using, as an undefined element will have no supported
attributes; in this case, see the element-undefined error message for
further information.

How to fix: check the spelling and case of the element and attribute,
(Remember XHTML is all lower-case) and/or check that they are both allowed
in the chosen document type, and/or use CSS instead of this attribute.


Can anyone tell me how to correct these errors?
Thanks
Brandon

[Mark Tranchant]

Re: Simple fix..validation errors at W3C...

Brandon wrote:[color=blue]
> I have settled on using FP 2002 for now.
> Can anyone tell me how to correct these errors?[/color]

I think that says it all.

We'll need a URL to investigate further, but you should really learn to
code by hand first, even if you eventually move to a coding tool
(although not FP). FrontPage is not designed to produce valid or good
code: it is designed to produce code that will look like what you
designed when viewing in recent IE versions.

--
Mark.

http://tranchant.plus.com/

[Matthias Gutfeldt]

Re: Simple fix..validation errors at W3C...

Brandon wrote:[color=blue]
> I am an amateur working on a first site, I have settled on using FP 2002 for
> now. My current page is up and live[/color]

Where? I'd consult my crystal ball, but it's in the shop! So please give
us the URL.


Matthias
--

http://blog.ch/

[Neal]

Re: Simple fix..validation errors at W3C...

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 04:14:50 -0700, Brandon <bnd-66@cox.nethefis h> wrote:
[color=blue]
> I am an amateur working on a first site, I have settled on using FP 2002
> for
> now.[/color]

"I'm an adolescent shaving for the first time, I have settled on using a
rusty pair of scissors for now."
[color=blue]
> My current page is up and live, but I have two errors that I cant seem
> to get rid of ...
>
> Line 29, column 6: duplicate specification of attribute "STYLE"
> style="border: 1px solid #00F;width: 750px; height: 690px;"[/color]

As has been mentioned, we'd need to see the HTML to know for sure, but do
you have two style attributes in this element?
[color=blue]
> Line 154, column 46: there is no attribute "BORDERCOLO R"
> <table border="0" cellspacing="0" bordercolor="#0 000FF" width="650"[/color]

The description is pretty clear - you're using bordercolor where you can't.

Let me introduce you to two new friends:

[http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/index/elements.html] - the list of HTML 4.01
elements
[http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/index/attributes.html] - the list of HTML
4.01 attributes

From this, we see that bordercolor is not a valid attribute. Instead, you
can use CSS to style the table border.

I highly recommend using a good HTML and CSS tutorial, download a nice
text editor (Crimson Editor is a nice one to try) and start learning it
the hard way - which, I think you'll eventually find, is really the easy
way! Using FP means you need to spend perhaps as much time as you did
making the page to correct its errors. It might take a little longer to do
it by hand, but you're going to get a stronger knowledge of what works and
what doesn't, and a much better page as a result.

[Andy Dingley]

Re: Simple fix..validation errors at W3C...

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 04:14:50 -0700, "Brandon" <bnd-66@cox.nethefis h>
wrote:
[color=blue]
>I have settled on using FP 2002 for now.[/color]

You're doomed. FP is incompatible with expecting your code to
validate. Either learn to hand-code (which isn't hard), use an
editor that's not brain-dead, or abandon any idea of writing valid
code.

Bill doesn't like valid code. He doesn't want you to use it.

[Lachlan Hunt]

Re: Simple fix..validation errors at W3C...

Brandon wrote:[color=blue]
> I am an amateur working on a first site[/color]

Yes, obviously.
[color=blue]
> I have settled on using FP 2002 for now.[/color]

FrontPage Horrors!

http://webstandards.org/buzz/archive/2004_08.html#a000408

It is extremely difficult to produce well structured and valid markup
using FrontPage. I'd recommend firing up Notepad or, if you like, a
descent text editor that provides syntax highlighting. Dreamweaver is
quite good, it comes very close to producing well structured and valid
markup by default, though it does have it's problems. However, if your
hand coding, like all professionals do, then the code is always as valid
as you write it.

If you just want a free editor, I like SuperEdi [1], which has very good
syntax highlighting and excellent unicode support, it's one of the best
free editor I've used.

There are many other good editors out there, and I've heard many good
reviews about the dirt and pointy stick editor [2]. Despite it being
written on dirt, the code is actually much cleaner than that produced by
FrontPage.
[color=blue]
> My current page is up and live[/color]

Really? I tried searching for it, but couldn't figure out which site it
was out of about 8,058,044,651 results.
[color=blue]
> Line 29, column 6: duplicate specification of attribute "STYLE"
> style="border: 1px solid #00F;width: 750px; height: 690px;"[/color]

Seems quite self explanitory to me. Obviously, you have two style
attributes. Remove one, and it should validate. Remove them both, and
put the style in an external stylesheet for best results.
[color=blue]
> Line 154, column 46: there is no attribute "BORDERCOLO R"
> <table border="0" cellspacing="0" bordercolor="#0 000FF" width="650"
>
> You have used the attribute named above in your document, but the document
> type you are using does not support that attribute for this element.[/color]

Again, that makes perfect sense! The way to fix it is to remove the
attribute. As the error message states, it is not allowed the element,
so removing it will fix the problem. It's also presentational, just
like the rest of those attributes in there. All presentation should be
specifed with a stylesheet, not presentational elements and attributes.

I'm assuming you actually read the error messages, but I don't get why
you couldn't understand them. However, many people have difficulty
understanding them, so what kind of information do you think would make
them clearer for you?

[1] http://www.wolosoft.com/en/superedi/
[2] http://editor.usenetshit.info/

--
Lachlan Hunt

http://lachy.id.au/

http://GetFirefox.com/ Rediscover the Web
http://SpreadFirefox.com/ Igniting the Web

[Harlan Messinger]

Re: Simple fix..validation errors at W3C...


"Brandon" <bnd-66@cox.nethefis h> wrote in message
news:BBknd.1045 94$kz3.84530@fe d1read02...[color=blue]
> I am an amateur working on a first site, I have settled on using FP 2002[/color]
for[color=blue]
> now. My current page is up and live, but I have two errors that I cant[/color]
seem[color=blue]
> to get rid of ...
>
> Line 29, column 6: duplicate specification of attribute "STYLE"
> style="border: 1px solid #00F;width: 750px; height: 690px;"
>
>
> Line 154, column 46: there is no attribute "BORDERCOLO R"
> <table border="0" cellspacing="0" bordercolor="#0 000FF" width="650"
>
> You have used the attribute named above in your document, but the document
> type you are using does not support that attribute for this element. This
> error is often caused by incorrect use of the "Strict" document type with[/color]
a[color=blue]
> document that uses frames (e.g. you must use the "Transition al" document
> type to get the "target" attribute), or by using vendor proprietary
> extensions such as "marginheig ht" (this is usually fixed by using CSS to
> achieve the desired effect instead).
>
> This error may also result if the element itself is not supported in the
> document type you are using, as an undefined element will have no[/color]
supported[color=blue]
> attributes; in this case, see the element-undefined error message for
> further information.
>
> How to fix: check the spelling and case of the element and attribute,
> (Remember XHTML is all lower-case) and/or check that they are both allowed
> in the chosen document type, and/or use CSS instead of this attribute.[/color]

If an error message says that you have duplicate specifications of the STYLE
attribute, then stop having duplicate specifications of the STYLE attribute.
Remove one.

The W3C should come up with a different way of reporting uses of tags or
attributes that are undefined in HTML. Saying "There is no ..." gives the
impression that there isn't one in your code and that there *should* be.
What it actually means is the opposite: there is no [whatever] in HTML, so
its presence in your code renders it invalid. In your case, the BORDERCOLOR
message is telling you that HTML has no BORDERCOLOR attribute. So stop using
it. Use CSS instead.

[Brandon]

Re: Simple fix..validation errors at W3C...


"Harlan Messinger" <h.messinger@co mcast.net> wrote in message
news:306fn9F2se abaU1@uni-berlin.de...[color=blue]
>
> "Brandon" <bnd-66@cox.nethefis h> wrote in message
> news:BBknd.1045 94$kz3.84530@fe d1read02...[/color]
[color=blue]
> If an error message says that you have duplicate specifications of the[/color]
STYLE[color=blue]
> attribute, then stop having duplicate specifications of the STYLE[/color]
attribute.[color=blue]
> Remove one.[/color]


I get that, the point here is that i have desgined this with FP , i dont
know what the definition of a style atrribute IS let alone how remove a
duplicate one.
[color=blue][color=green]
> > Line 29, column 6: duplicate specification of attribute "STYLE"
> > style="border: 1px solid #00F;width: 750px; height: 690px;"[/color][/color]

Same here, basically i dont understand what it is telling me, because i dont
know how to define what part of the code is the failing.[color=blue][color=green]
> > Line 154, column 46: there is no attribute "BORDERCOLO R"
> > <table border="0" cellspacing="0" bordercolor="#0 000FF" width="650"[/color][/color]

Thanks for the input

To all: i appreciate the input regarding FP...i shall look for an
alternative, any additional siggestions for a WYSIWYG editor appreciate,.

[color=blue]
> The W3C should come up with a different way of reporting uses of tags or
> attributes that are undefined in HTML. Saying "There is no ..." gives the
> impression that there isn't one in your code and that there *should* be.
> What it actually means is the opposite: there is no [whatever] in HTML, so
> its presence in your code renders it invalid. In your case, the[/color]
BORDERCOLOR[color=blue]
> message is telling you that HTML has no BORDERCOLOR attribute. So stop[/color]
using[color=blue]
> it. Use CSS instead.
>[/color]

[Brian]

Re: Simple fix..validation errors at W3C...

Brandon wrote:
[color=blue]
> i shall look for an alternative, any additional siggestions for a
> WYSIWYG editor appreciate,.[/color]

WYSIWYG is not really applicable on the web, so any any HTML editor
which claims to be WYSIWYG is suspect. What you should use is an editor
that helps create html markup with visuals as an afterthought. Ideally,
it should have some way of managing common parts of a site (including a
menu on all pages, taking into account site structure, avoiding links
that point to the same page, ...). In other words, a combined
pre-processor and html editor that assists in creating tags and
attributes. So far, I've not seen such a thing. In fact, I've tried a
couple of pre-processors and found them woefully lacking.

My only advice: learn HTML and code with a text editor that has
search-and-replace across files, has templates, macros, etc. And do the
preprocessing yourself. I like Notetab.

--
Brian (remove "invalid" to email me)

[Barbara de Zoete]

Re: Simple fix..validation errors at W3C...

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 13:21:16 -0700, Brandon <bnd-66@cox.nethefis h> wrote:
[color=blue]
> To all: i appreciate the input regarding FP...i shall look for an
> alternative, any additional siggestions for a WYSIWYG editor appreciate,.[/color]

What You See Is _*NOT*_ What You Get.[1] I recommand that you get a firm knowledge of markup and then styles, how to keep them separated and let content dictate the markup and the style at the same time.
There is not much wrong with these so_called WYSI(n)WYG editors. Most of the times it is the user. Come to think of it, all of the times it is the user ;-) Use FP, but use with care.

[1]Think of all the GUI out there (names, engines, versions) and all the platforms and all the _not_GUI out there too (plain text, braille, aural). You will never ever get what you see in a WYSI(n)WYG editor.

--
Weblog | <http://home.wanadoo.nl/b.de.zoete/_private/weblog.html>
Webontwerp | <http://home.wanadoo.nl/b.de.zoete/html/webontwerp.html >
Zweefvliegen | <http://home.wanadoo.nl/b.de.zoete/html/vliegen.html>

[Brandon]

Re: Simple fix..validation errors at W3C...

Input duly noted, in the mean time, can anyone tell me how to correct these
two errors in the current code??

The point here is that I have designed this with FP I don't
know what the definition of a style attribute IS let alone how remove a
duplicate one.
[color=blue][color=green]
> > Line 29, column 6: duplicate specification of attribute "STYLE"
> > style="border: 1px solid #00F;width: 750px; height: 690px;"[/color][/color]

Same here, basically i dont understand what it is telling me, because i dont
know how to define what part of the code is the failing.
[color=blue][color=green]
> > Line 154, column 46: there is no attribute "BORDERCOLO R"
> > <table border="0" cellspacing="0" bordercolor="#0 000FF" width="650"[/color][/color]


Folks, I do appreciate the fact that I need to move away from FP, but I
don't have the time or the need to become THAT proficient in coding? I
analogize it with becoming a mechanical engineer so that I can change a tire
on my car...


Thanks for the input.
Brandon

"Barbara de Zoete" <b_de_zoete@hot mail.com> wrote in message
news:opshqbievm x5vgts@zoete_b. ..[color=blue]
> On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 13:21:16 -0700, Brandon <bnd-66@cox.nethefis h> wrote:
>[color=green]
> > To all: i appreciate the input regarding FP...i shall look for an
> > alternative, any additional siggestions for a WYSIWYG editor[/color][/color]
appreciate,.[color=blue]
>
> What You See Is _*NOT*_ What You Get.[1] I recommand that you get a firm[/color]
knowledge of markup and then styles, how to keep them separated and let
content dictate the markup and the style at the same time.[color=blue]
> There is not much wrong with these so_called WYSI(n)WYG editors. Most of[/color]
the times it is the user. Come to think of it, all of the times it is the
user ;-) Use FP, but use with care.[color=blue]
>
> [1]Think of all the GUI out there (names, engines, versions) and all the[/color]
platforms and all the _not_GUI out there too (plain text, braille, aural).
You will never ever get what you see in a WYSI(n)WYG editor.[color=blue]
>
> --
> Weblog | <http://home.wanadoo.nl/b.de.zoete/_private/weblog.html>
> Webontwerp | <http://home.wanadoo.nl/b.de.zoete/html/webontwerp.html >
> Zweefvliegen | <http://home.wanadoo.nl/b.de.zoete/html/vliegen.html>[/color]

[Lachlan Hunt]

Re: Simple fix..validation errors at W3C...

Brandon wrote:[color=blue]
> Input duly noted, in the mean time, can anyone tell me how to correct these
> two errors in the current code??[/color]

We already told you how to fix these errors.
[color=blue][color=green][color=darkred]
>>>Line 29, column 6: duplicate specification of attribute "STYLE"
>>>style="borde r: 1px solid #00F;width: 750px; height: 690px;"[/color][/color][/color]

Open up the file in Notepad, not FrontPage. Press Ctrl+G and enter line
29. You will see an element that contains the above style attribute,
and there will be two of them. Remove one to fix the problem.

eg.
<td style="border: 1px solid #00F;width: 750px; height: 690px;"
style="border: 1px solid #00F;width: 750px; height: 690px;">

(where td could be any element, I just took a guess at the most likely
suspect, considering your using FP, and undoubtedly using tables for
layout, which should not be done.)
[color=blue]
> Same here, basically i dont understand what it is telling me, because i dont
> know how to define what part of the code is the failing.
>
>[color=green][color=darkred]
>>>Line 154, column 46: there is no attribute "BORDERCOLO R"
>>><table border="0" cellspacing="0" bordercolor="#0 000FF" width="650"[/color][/color][/color]

Go to line 154. Notice the bordercolor="#0 000FF" attribute. Remove it.
[color=blue]
> Folks, I do appreciate the fact that I need to move away from FP, but I
> don't have the time or the need to become THAT proficient in coding?[/color]

You don't need to become really efficient, but if you're going to make a
website, you need to at least understand the basics of reading and
editing source code. The fact that you're learning, and have no clue
about reading source code, based on your questions, is enough reason for
you to avoid WYSI(n)WIG editors all together, since you are unable to
clean up the mess.

--
Lachlan Hunt

http://lachy.id.au/

http://GetFirefox.com/ Rediscover the Web
http://SpreadFirefox.com/ Igniting the Web

[Andy Dingley]

Re: Simple fix..validation errors at W3C...

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 13:21:16 -0700, "Brandon" <bnd-66@cox.nethefis h>
wrote:
[color=blue]
>any additional siggestions for a WYSIWYG editor appreciate,.[/color]

There are none.

We know what a lousy (or borderline OK) WYSIWYG editor should do.
There are editors that do this. FP is a bad example of the genre.

We know what a really good WYSIWYG editor should do. None of them
currently do this. (there's a good thread in talking in detail about
this, if anyone cares)


If you really just want to go for it, hack up your code with FP and
stop worrying. It'll work, for small values of "work". Forget trying
to validate it though.

--
Smert' spamionam

[Brian]

Re: Simple fix..validation errors at W3C...

Brandon wrote:
[color=blue]
> Folks, I do appreciate the fact that I need to move away from FP, but
> I don't have the time or the need to become THAT proficient in
> coding?[/color]

Is that a question that we're meant to answer? It looks like you're
telling us that you don't have the time or need.
[color=blue]
> I analogize it with becoming a mechanical engineer so that I can
> change a tire on my car...[/color]

HTML was supposed to be a simple markup language, within reach of
amateurs. And indeed it is, if you decide to use it as it was intended,
as a semantic markup language. It is easy to learn <h1>, <p>, and <ul>.
But there was a rather substantial detour when folks tried to shoehorn
it into a dtp language. Whence came the wysiwyg idea.

You said you wanted a wysiwyg editor, and that you've settled on FP. But
you don't like the markup errors it produces. Don't use the tool if you
don't like the results. Or keep the tool, and accept the results. Your
choice.

--
Brian (remove "invalid" to email me)

[Neal]

Re: Simple fix..validation errors at W3C...

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 16:48:11 -0700, Brandon <bnd-66@cox.nethefis h> wrote:
[color=blue]
> I
> analogize it with becoming a mechanical engineer so that I can change a
> tire
> on my car...
>[/color]

Replace "change a tire" to "replacing the transmission" or "doing an
alignment" and I'll agree. But it changes it entirely.

I analogize using FP to make a website with buying a few thousand dollars
of repair and diagnostic equipment without gaining the requisite knowledge
to use it.

FP has as its basic flaw, one that many other so-called WYSIWYG editors
share, that it purports to make the web page for you without your having
to know what to do.

Changing a tire, that's routine and every driver should know how to do
that, along with refueling, checking the oil and coolant and adding fluid
as needed, and changing a headlight. What FP claims to do is far more
complex than that - it's something that I would never trust a computer
program to accomplish all on its own.

You're attempting to equate designing a web page with "changing a tire"
when in essence you're building a whole new car. Don't trivialize web
authoring even though FP suggests you should.