OBJECT and EMBED

**Jukka K. Korpela** · Jun 19 '07, 01:55 PM

Re: OBJECT and EMBED

Scripsit Ben Sharvy:

I'd like to bring a page into HTML 4 compliance,

Don't bother. But write _new_ pages according to HTML 4.01 Strict, unless
you have good reasons to deviate. (Good reasons available for a reasonable
price from me. :-) )

but I can't
understand the information about the <OBJECTtag that I read at help
sites.

Check the specification then. Quite often, after trying some poor tutorials,
things magically become clear if you look at the original specifications.

http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

**Andy Dingley** · Jun 19 '07, 08:55 PM

Re: OBJECT and EMBED

On Tue, 19 Jun 2007 06:07:40 -0700, Ben Sharvy <spamblam@hotma il.com>
wrote:

>I'd like to bring a page into HTML 4 compliance,

><embed src="soundfile. mov" autostart="true " loop="false"
>hidden="true "</embed>

Keep it as <embed There's no direct equivalent in HTML 4 and <embed>
works better than the alternatives. <embedthrows content at the
user's desktop and asks it to choose a player. The HTML standards-based
approaches select the player(s) and hope they're the best and most
appropriate choice on an unknown computer.

As background music or video is so contrary to the W3C's view of how eb
documents ought to work, there's really no practical chance of getting
an equally good implementation _and_ conforming to the standard. So long
as you know by how much you're non-conformant and what the results are
(in this case, negligible) then you don't have to worry about being
fully conformant.

**Alexander Clauss** · Jun 19 '07, 10:05 PM

Re: OBJECT and EMBED

Jukka K. Korpela <jkorpela@cs.tu t.fiwrote:

I think the "param" element should be used for this:

<object data="soundfile .mov" width="0" height="0">
<param name="autostart " value="true">
<param name="loop" value="false">
</object>
--
Alexander

**Adrienne Boswell** · Jun 20 '07, 02:15 AM

Re: OBJECT and EMBED

Gazing into my crystal ball I observed "Jukka K. Korpela"
<jkorpela@cs.tu t.fiwriting in news:JbRdi.1804 74$vd5.114342
@reader1.news.s aunalahti.fi:

No-nonsense Authoring League

Can I join? I pledge to:

1. Not open windows using _blank or any other method
2. Use the right markup for the job
3. Not try to force anything on users
4. Test documents in as many browsers as possible for usability.
5. Not write bloated server side code
6. Not write bloaded client side markup
7. Not use javascript unless it helps the user (not the author)
8. Spell check everything
9. Check for broken links
10. Not use gratuitious multimedia and/or client side script

I'm sure there are a lot more requirements... .

--
Adrienne Boswell at Home
Arbpen Web Site Design Services

http://www.cavalcade-of-coding.info

Please respond to the group so others can share

**Jukka K. Korpela** · Jun 21 '07, 08:35 PM

Re: OBJECT and EMBED

Scripsit Alexander Clauss:

>There's no counterpart in HTML 4 for the autostart and loop
>attributes.

>
I think the "param" element should be used for this:

Should it? By which specification? Did you actually check whether it has the
desired effect? Can I use
<param name="wish" value="do what I mean">
too?

--
Jukka K. Korpela ("Yucca")

http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

**Alexander Clauss** · Jun 21 '07, 09:25 PM

Re: OBJECT and EMBED

Jukka K. Korpela <jkorpela@cs.tu t.fiwrote:

Should it? By which specification?

The name/value pairs of PARAM elements are passed to the plugin
that is used for the OBJECT element. The same happens for
the "name='valu e'" attributes in EMBED.

the desired effect? Can I use <param name="wish" value="do what I mean">

All these name/value pairs must be supported by the plugin that is
used. And when the plugin supports these pairs, it shouldn't care
if these are defined as "name='valu e'" attribute in an EMBED tag
or as name/value attributes in PARAM tags for OBJECT.

And in my experience this does indeed work this way in most browsers.

--
Alexander

**-Lost** · Jun 21 '07, 10:25 PM

Re: OBJECT and EMBED

Jukka K. Korpela wrote:

Scripsit Alexander Clauss:
>

>>There's no counterpart in HTML 4 for the autostart and loop
>>attributes.

>>
>I think the "param" element should be used for this:

>
Should it? By which specification? Did you actually check whether it has
the desired effect? Can I use
<param name="wish" value="do what I mean">
too?

Do you actually know markup as well as your self-proclaimed superiority
complex denotes? No. You don't.

http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/struct/....html#h-13.3.2

--
-Lost
Remove the extra words to reply by e-mail. Don't e-mail me. I am
kidding. No I am not.

**Jukka K. Korpela** · Jun 22 '07, 10:45 AM

Re: OBJECT and EMBED

Scripsit Alexander Clauss:

Jukka K. Korpela <jkorpela@cs.tu t.fiwrote:
>

>Should it? By which specification?

>
The name/value pairs of PARAM elements are passed to the plugin
that is used for the OBJECT element.

Yes. So what?

The same happens for
the "name='valu e'" attributes in EMBED.

Maybe. That's not part of any specification.

>the desired effect? Can I use <param name="wish" value="do what I
>mean">

>
All these name/value pairs must be supported by the plugin that is
used.

Maybe they "must" in some sense (namely "otherwise the idea won't work"),
but the question was about "should".

And when the plugin supports these pairs, it shouldn't care
if these are defined as "name='valu e'" attribute in an EMBED tag
or as name/value attributes in PARAM tags for OBJECT.

That's possible but irrelevant when asking what _should_ happen.

And in my experience this does indeed work this way in most browsers.

I guess you haven't checked new browsers like IE 7 and FF 2 then. And the
behavior varies by plugin, too, of course.

In practice, autostart="true " or <param name="autostart " value="true"doe s
not seem to "work" on the browsers I normally use. I'm _quite_ happy with
that.

--
Jukka K. Korpela ("Yucca")

http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

**Ben Sharvy** · Jun 25 '07, 12:45 PM

Re: OBJECT and EMBED

Is there a system of embedding <EMBEDwithin <OBJECT>, so that that
browser will try <OBJECTfirst, and if that is not supported, use
<EMBED>?

**Andy Dingley** · Jun 25 '07, 12:55 PM

Re: OBJECT and EMBED

On 25 Jun, 13:41, Ben Sharvy <spamb...@hotma il.comwrote:

Is there a system of embedding <EMBEDwithin <OBJECT>, so that that
browser will try <OBJECTfirst, and if that is not supported, use
<EMBED>?

Yes and no. There is, but what you actually want is for it to try
<embedfirst (client's choice of player) and <objectafterwar ds
(server's choice of player. I don't know any way to do that.

**Osmo Saarikumpu** · Jun 27 '07, 09:35 AM

Re: OBJECT and EMBED

Ben Sharvy wrote:

Is there a system of embedding <EMBEDwithin <OBJECT>, so that that
browser will try <OBJECTfirst, and if that is not supported, use
<EMBED>?

For special cases only. E.g. offering a Flash object as an Active-X
component and using embed as the 1st fall back for browsers without
Active-X support.

Osmo

**prac** · Jul 3 '07, 08:35 PM

Re: OBJECT and EMBED

Hello

Best way is to include all the param in a script

It solves the problem of compliance, and there is no more message
"click here to activate ..."

I make all my video like this :

Schenk family Suisse - Producteur et distributeur de vins depuis 1893

http://philippe.chappuis.googlepages.com/video

Depuis 1893, Schenk partage sa passion du vin. Découvrez notre grande sélection de crus exceptionnels: Chasselas de domaines réputés, Chardonnay, Pinot Noir, Humagne, Gamay, Syrah, etc.

I hope this help you

---

Schenk family Suisse - Producteur et distributeur de vins depuis 1893

http://philippe.chappuis.googlepages.com

Depuis 1893, Schenk partage sa passion du vin. Découvrez notre grande sélection de crus exceptionnels: Chasselas de domaines réputés, Chardonnay, Pinot Noir, Humagne, Gamay, Syrah, etc.

http://www.ziki.com/people/prac53

Blog not found

http://viti-vino-feed.blogspot.com

Blogger is a blog publishing tool from Google for easily sharing your thoughts with the world. Blogger makes it simple to post text, photos and video onto your personal or team blog.

Schenk family Suisse - Producteur et distributeur de vins depuis 1893

http://wine.pictures.googlepages.com

Depuis 1893, Schenk partage sa passion du vin. Découvrez notre grande sélection de crus exceptionnels: Chasselas de domaines réputés, Chardonnay, Pinot Noir, Humagne, Gamay, Syrah, etc.

Schenk family Suisse - Producteur et distributeur de vins depuis 1893

http://wines.search.googlepages.com

Depuis 1893, Schenk partage sa passion du vin. Découvrez notre grande sélection de crus exceptionnels: Chasselas de domaines réputés, Chardonnay, Pinot Noir, Humagne, Gamay, Syrah, etc.

Schenk family Suisse - Producteur et distributeur de vins depuis 1893

http://winemap.googlepages.com

Depuis 1893, Schenk partage sa passion du vin. Découvrez notre grande sélection de crus exceptionnels: Chasselas de domaines réputés, Chardonnay, Pinot Noir, Humagne, Gamay, Syrah, etc.

---

**Marc Schmidt** · Jul 4 '07, 12:25 PM

Re: OBJECT and EMBED

prac <philippe.chapp uis@gmail.comwr ote:

Best way is to include all the param in a script

It's definitely the best way to make sure that nothing works at all
if JavaScript is disabled. And it's a very good way to introduce many
issues you would never have, if done without Javascript...

>I make all my video like this :
>http://philippe.chappuis.googlepages.com/video

This is a very funny "noscript" alternative you've added in your code
;-)

<noscript>Add link rel for favicon ie and ff</noscript>

But unfortunately it doesn't make any sense. Also using JavaScript
to add a FavIcon or add any other IE specific workaround is not very
clever. Nothing will work if JavaScript is disabled and it's also not
necessary at all, especially when done in the way you've done it.

In case you really need to address IE because of it's bugs, just use
conditional comments. These work without JavaScript, these do not break
any standards or standards-compliant browsers.

--
Marc

OBJECT and EMBED

OBJECT and EMBED

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