new visual basic.net application

[=?Utf-8?B?V2VuZHkgRWxpemFiZXRo?=]

Questions about creating an .net ‘executable†™ 2005 that will not remained
installed once a user enters some data into the application. I also want this
applcation to not require any previous software installed on a users
workstation.
I basically want to setup an application for new users when they are
applying for insurance. This application would preferably be a run as a
windows desktop application versus on the internet. Once the user enters the
save or submit button, I want the application to send the data back to be
processed on a Sql server 2000 or sql server 2005 database.
I have Visual Studio.net 2005 currently and would like suggestions on how
to do steup this type of an application using Visual Basic.net 2005.

Thanks!

[Scott M.]

Re: new visual basic.net application

If you are not interested in having any remains of your application left on
the client after using the application then this needs to be an ASP .NET web
application.

If you don't want to require any software on the client, then this needs to
be an ASP .NET web application.

If all you are trying to do is send some data to your SQL server, then this
needs to be an ASP .NET web application.

It sounds like you simply need a web page that collects data and populates a
SQL table.


"Wendy Elizabeth" <WendyElizabeth @discussions.mi crosoft.comwrot e in
message news:B455B111-7525-444B-A102-6F63E98C7959@mi crosoft.com...

Questions about creating an .net 'executable' 2005 that will not remained
installed once a user enters some data into the application. I also want
this
applcation to not require any previous software installed on a users
workstation.
I basically want to setup an application for new users when they are
applying for insurance. This application would preferably be a run as a
windows desktop application versus on the internet. Once the user enters
the
save or submit button, I want the application to send the data back to be
processed on a Sql server 2000 or sql server 2005 database.
I have Visual Studio.net 2005 currently and would like suggestions on how
to do steup this type of an application using Visual Basic.net 2005.
>
Thanks!
>

[=?Utf-8?B?U3VydHVyWg==?=]

Re: new visual basic.net application

You could also make a ClickOnce "Online Only" application.

This actually does install the app locally, but it doesn't look like it.
i.e. no shortcuts or anything are left.

--
David Streeter
Synchrotech Software
Sydney Australia


"Scott M." wrote:

If you are not interested in having any remains of your application left on
the client after using the application then this needs to be an ASP .NET web
application.
>
If you don't want to require any software on the client, then this needs to
be an ASP .NET web application.
>
If all you are trying to do is send some data to your SQL server, then this
needs to be an ASP .NET web application.
>
It sounds like you simply need a web page that collects data and populates a
SQL table.
>
>
"Wendy Elizabeth" <WendyElizabeth @discussions.mi crosoft.comwrot e in
message news:B455B111-7525-444B-A102-6F63E98C7959@mi crosoft.com...

Questions about creating an .net 'executable' 2005 that will not remained
installed once a user enters some data into the application. I also want
this
applcation to not require any previous software installed on a users
workstation.
I basically want to setup an application for new users when they are
applying for insurance. This application would preferably be a run as a
windows desktop application versus on the internet. Once the user enters
the
save or submit button, I want the application to send the data back to be
processed on a Sql server 2000 or sql server 2005 database.
I have Visual Studio.net 2005 currently and would like suggestions on how
to do steup this type of an application using Visual Basic.net 2005.

Thanks!

>
>
>

[Cor Ligthert[MVP]]

Re: new visual basic.net application

Wendy,

You mean that you want to set a kind of delete file(s) script in the
scheduler?

Cor

[Spam Catcher]

Re: new visual basic.net application

=?Utf-8?B?U3VydHVyWg= =?= <surturz@newsgr oup.nospamwrote in news:557B3B4A-
1ED2-4543-BC1A-74AFE2A81C80@mi crosoft.com:

You could also make a ClickOnce "Online Only" application.
>
This actually does install the app locally, but it doesn't look like it.
i.e. no shortcuts or anything are left.

Unfortunately ClickOnce just doesn't work well in an uncontrolled
environment.

..NET lacks a good "web start" or applet capability.

There is Silverlight... but it requires yet another runtime and programming
model.

--
spamhoneypot@ro gers.com (Do not e-mail)

[RobinS]

Re: new visual basic.net application

What do you mean by this statement?

Unfortunately ClickOnce just doesn't work well in an uncontrolled
environment.

RobinS.
-----------------------------------------
"Spam Catcher" <spamhoneypot@r ogers.comwrote in message
news:Xns9A25177 53DCB1usenethon eypotrogers@127 .0.0.1...

=?Utf-8?B?U3VydHVyWg= =?= <surturz@newsgr oup.nospamwrote in
news:557B3B4A-
1ED2-4543-BC1A-74AFE2A81C80@mi crosoft.com:
>

>You could also make a ClickOnce "Online Only" application.
>>
>This actually does install the app locally, but it doesn't look like it.
>i.e. no shortcuts or anything are left.

>
Unfortunately ClickOnce just doesn't work well in an uncontrolled
environment.
>
.NET lacks a good "web start" or applet capability.
>
There is Silverlight... but it requires yet another runtime and
programming
model.
>
--
spamhoneypot@ro gers.com (Do not e-mail)

[Spam Catcher]

Re: new visual basic.net application

"RobinS" <robins@imnotte lling.comwrote in
news:7LqdndPyhu 0vihHanZ2dnUVZ_ u6rnZ2d@comcast .com:

What do you mean by this statement?
>

>Unfortunatel y ClickOnce just doesn't work well in an uncontrolled
>environment.

Several reasons:

1. ClickOnce doesn't work with FireFox
2. ClickOnce may not work under restrictive user account permissions
3. Lacks the ability to deploy to multiple environments
4. If .NET framework is not installed, the detection script doesn't work
all the time
5. If custom components are used, sometimes chained installers don't run
correctly (had issues with Managed DirectX)

For simple/demo application it works great, but in a production envrionment
I've run into too many issues to recommend ClickOnce.

--
spamhoneypot@ro gers.com (Do not e-mail)

[=?Utf-8?B?V2VuZHkgRWxpemFiZXRo?=]

Re: new visual basic.net application

Cor Ligthert[MVP]" :

Yes.

Wendy

"Cor Ligthert[MVP]" wrote:

Wendy,
>
You mean that you want to set a kind of delete file(s) script in the
scheduler?
>
Cor
>

[RobinS]

Re: new visual basic.net application


"Spam Catcher" <spamhoneypot@r ogers.comwrote in message
news:Xns9A25DE5 C99038usenethon eypotrogers@127 .0.0.1...

"RobinS" <robins@imnotte lling.comwrote in
news:7LqdndPyhu 0vihHanZ2dnUVZ_ u6rnZ2d@comcast .com:
>

>What do you mean by this statement?
>>

>>Unfortunate ly ClickOnce just doesn't work well in an uncontrolled
>>environment .

>
Several reasons:
>
1. ClickOnce doesn't work with FireFox

Yes it does. If you are using VS2005, there is a plug-in to Firefox that
enables it work with ClickOnce. If you are using VS2008, the CLickOnce
deployment works inherently with Firefox, Opera, AND Safari with no plug-in
required.

2. ClickOnce may not work under restrictive user account permissions

The point of ClickOnce is to not require any permissions. If you are being
even more restrictive than Windows Vista, then you may have problems.
ClickOnce installs to the user's profile folders. Unless you're locking that
down, it should be fine.

3. Lacks the ability to deploy to multiple environments

Can you provide more detail as to what you mean by "multiple environments"?

4. If .NET framework is not installed, the detection script doesn't work
all the time

We haven't had this problem with our deployment to thousands of users. We
do, however, occasionally run across someone who has trouble installing the
..Net Framework as a prerequisite.

5. If custom components are used, sometimes chained installers don't run
correctly (had issues with Managed DirectX)

You may have to deploy these as prerequisites. We are deploying DirectX, but
we are including only the dll's we need in our deployment and installing
them as local resources to the application, not in the GAC, so we aren't
having any security issues with those, and it works fine. We have found that
we can deploy most things this way, which removes all security concerns, as
well as the possibility of someone else deinstalling your dll's, or
replacing them with a newer version.

>
For simple/demo application it works great, but in a production
envrionment
I've run into too many issues to recommend ClickOnce.
>
--
spamhoneypot@ro gers.com (Do not e-mail)

That's a shame. My company is very happy with it. Microsoft uses it to push
its HR software to 80,000 employees, and GoToMeeting is the other
application that comes straight to mind that uses it exclusively for
deploying its product.

RobinS.
GoldMail, Inc.

[Spam Catcher]

Re: new visual basic.net application

"RobinS" <robins@imnotte lling.comwrote in
news:KMCdnQG4fr uF5BHanZ2dnUVZ_ u6rnZ2d@comcast .com:

>3. Lacks the ability to deploy to multiple environments

>
Can you provide more detail as to what you mean by "multiple
environments"?

In .NET 2005, it was tough to deploy to development, test, and
production environment. The ClickOnce files could not be manually moved
because the manifests had to be resigned to the deployment URL. I
understand this was supposedly fixed in 2008?

>4. If .NET framework is not installed, the detection script doesn't
>work all the time

>
We haven't had this problem with our deployment to thousands of users.
We do, however, occasionally run across someone who has trouble
installing the .Net Framework as a prerequisite.

I've seen this happen if Internet Explorer has the framework version
overriden in the IExplore.exe.co nfig file, the detection script may not
complete properly.

That's a shame. My company is very happy with it. Microsoft uses it to
push its HR software to 80,000 employees, and GoToMeeting is the other
application that comes straight to mind that uses it exclusively for
deploying its product.

Except for GotoMeeting, your experience and Microsoft's have been to
internal users. When you have control over the corporate machines
ClickOnce can work (known permissions, ability to manually deploy pre-
reqs, etc. However, I believe the OP wanted to deploy an insurance
application to customers (probably home users)? Unfortunately home PCs
are too varied for ClickOnce to correctly each and everytime.

I like the concept of ClickOnce... maybe I'll try it again with VS.NET
2008 and see if there are any major improvements.

Oh, I had another issue - I would deploy new versions of a software ...
and some machines wouldn't detect the updated files. Apparently others
have had a similar issue. Never had time to dig deeper why certain
machines wouldn't update themselves after a while.

--
spamhoneypot@ro gers.com (Do not e-mail)

[RobinS]

Re: new visual basic.net application


"Spam Catcher" <spamhoneypot@r ogers.comwrote in message
news:Xns9A2673A F286ADusenethon eypotrogers@127 .0.0.1...

"RobinS" <robins@imnotte lling.comwrote in
news:KMCdnQG4fr uF5BHanZ2dnUVZ_ u6rnZ2d@comcast .com:
>

>>3. Lacks the ability to deploy to multiple environments

>>
>Can you provide more detail as to what you mean by "multiple
>environments "?

>
In .NET 2005, it was tough to deploy to development, test, and
production environment. The ClickOnce files could not be manually moved
because the manifests had to be resigned to the deployment URL. I
understand this was supposedly fixed in 2008?

I heard something about this, but would have to go searching for it. I
thought it was more along the lines of letting you change something w/o
using MageUI, but I could be wrong. We deploy our development, test, and
production versions to different URLs, so this has not been a problem for
us.

>

>>4. If .NET framework is not installed, the detection script doesn't
>>work all the time

>>
>We haven't had this problem with our deployment to thousands of users.
>We do, however, occasionally run across someone who has trouble
>installing the .Net Framework as a prerequisite.

>
I've seen this happen if Internet Explorer has the framework version
overriden in the IExplore.exe.co nfig file, the detection script may not
complete properly.
>

I'll file away that piece of information. We have not had this problem that
I'm aware of. The biggest problem we've had is how long it takes to install
the .Net Framework, and that's not something we have control over, dang it.

>That's a shame. My company is very happy with it. Microsoft uses it to
>push its HR software to 80,000 employees, and GoToMeeting is the other
>application that comes straight to mind that uses it exclusively for
>deploying its product.

>
Except for GotoMeeting, your experience and Microsoft's have been to
internal users. When you have control over the corporate machines
ClickOnce can work (known permissions, ability to manually deploy pre-
reqs, etc. However, I believe the OP wanted to deploy an insurance
application to customers (probably home users)? Unfortunately home PCs
are too varied for ClickOnce to correctly each and everytime.

Actually, we are deploying our product externally, not internally, to a
large number of users (>1000). We do have some issues here and there with
the deployment, but overall it is working fairly well. We only support
Windows XP and Vista, not anything older, so maybe that helps.

Our product lets you make slideshow presentations with voiceover or a sound
file, converting them into a sort of movie that can be run from our servers.
You send a URL, and it plays in any browser (thanks to VS2008).

Here's an example; I made this GoldMail from my trip to Las Vegas last year
(I lost $72); it shows the fountains in front of the Bellagio:

http://cdn2.goldmail.com/?GMID=s17taj8mjg6r

Feel free to sign up for a free account and try out the deployment (and the
product!) by either clicking on the link at the end of the presentation, or
going to www.goldmail.com.

>
I like the concept of ClickOnce... maybe I'll try it again with VS.NET
2008 and see if there are any major improvements.
>
Oh, I had another issue - I would deploy new versions of a software ...
and some machines wouldn't detect the updated files. Apparently others
have had a similar issue. Never had time to dig deeper why certain
machines wouldn't update themselves after a while.
>
--
spamhoneypot@ro gers.com (Do not e-mail)

That's another problem we have not seen yet. We have had a lot of discussion
about forcing the updates, but we're not going there yet. We'll keep an eye
out for this problem, though.

Thanks for the info.

RobinS.
GoldMail, Inc.