alternate language

**Lou Pecora** · Dec 11 '06, 02:25 PM

Re: alternate language

In article <mailman.1382.1 165821112.32031 .python-list@python.org >,
Bryan <belred@gmail.c omwrote:

what is a good alternate language to learn? i just want something to expand
my mind and hopefully reduce or delay any chance of alzheimer's. i would
especially like to hear from those of you who learned python _before_ these
languages.
>
haskell, erlang, ocaml, mozart/oz, rebel, etc.

I have no experience with any of these. Of course, now I will give my
opinions. :-) Just based on my experience with Python, C, C++, BASIC
(several flavors), Fortran 77 (mostly).

>
i don't require any of these features, but extra browny points for any of
the following:
>
interactive interpreter

Python has several.

batteries included

Not sure what you mean here. Certainly the standard Python packages
would offer you an immediately usable Python from Terminal and some
other interpreters. But there are LOTS of add-ons available. A big
plus with Open Source. Keeping them coordinated is a task, though (a
big minus with Open Source). Overall, I haven't had to mess too much to
get lots of usability from Python, especially for Scientific computing.

can integrate with c

Yes. Several approaches, but none trivial.

compiles to native code

No.

can use a gui toolkit such as wx

Yep. Wx is here for Python. Also a book on it by Rappin and Dunn
(Manning , publ. 2006)

doesn't take 60 hour weeks over years to master

You'll be writing code on day 1. Useful code, too. Very, very nice
language to learn and use. I recommend Python in a Nutshell by Martelli
(O'Reilly Publ.) to read as you learn. Lots of online tutorials. See
Python.org, SourceForge and google. I think you can get pretty good at
Python coding in a month or so.

Along with Perl and Ruby, Python is really a very popular
interpreted/scripting language rather than a niche language (which I
think most of the ones you mentioned are somewhat niche). That means
there's a big, helpful community out there to talk to and lots of code
available. I do all my new coding in it and then when I need speed in
some routine I rewrite it in C as a Python extension. I can develop
many times faster than I could in C/C++ or Fortran or BASIC (even). I
cannot compare, however, to the languages you mentioned. Sorry.

-- Lou Pecora (my views are my own) REMOVE THIS to email me.

**Aahz** · Dec 11 '06, 03:55 PM

Re: alternate language

In article <pecora-4D488A.09490311 122006@ra.nrl.n avy.mil>,
Lou Pecora <pecora@anvil.n rl.navy.milwrot e:

>In article <mailman.1382.1 165821112.32031 .python-list@python.org >,
Bryan <belred@gmail.c omwrote:

>>
>what is a good alternate language to learn? i just want something to expand
>my mind and hopefully reduce or delay any chance of alzheimer's. i would
>especially like to hear from those of you who learned python _before_ these
>languages.
>>
>haskell, erlang, ocaml, mozart/oz, rebel, etc.

>
>I have no experience with any of these. Of course, now I will give my
>opinions. :-) Just based on my experience with Python, C, C++, BASIC
>(several flavors), Fortran 77 (mostly).
>

>i don't require any of these features, but extra browny points for any of
>the following:
>>
>interactive interpreter

>
>Python has several.

Um... I think the original poster is saying that he already knows Python
and wants to learn another language. He particularly wants opinions from
other people who have learned these languages *after* learning Python.
--
Aahz (aahz@pythoncra ft.com) <* http://www.pythoncraft.com/

Member of the Groucho Marx Fan Club

**Lou Pecora** · Dec 11 '06, 04:35 PM

Re: alternate language

In article <elk057$1m7$1@p anix3.panix.com >, aahz@pythoncraf t.com (Aahz)
wrote:

In article <pecora-4D488A.09490311 122006@ra.nrl.n avy.mil>,
Lou Pecora <pecora@anvil.n rl.navy.milwrot e:

In article <mailman.1382.1 165821112.32031 .python-list@python.org >,
Bryan <belred@gmail.c omwrote:

>
what is a good alternate language to learn? i just want something to expand
my mind and hopefully reduce or delay any chance of alzheimer's. i would
especially like to hear from those of you who learned python _before_ these
languages.
>
haskell, erlang, ocaml, mozart/oz, rebel, etc.

I have no experience with any of these. Of course, now I will give my
opinions. :-) Just based on my experience with Python, C, C++, BASIC
(several flavors), Fortran 77 (mostly).

i don't require any of these features, but extra browny points for any of
the following:
>
interactive interpreter

Python has several.

>
Um... I think the original poster is saying that he already knows Python
and wants to learn another language. He particularly wants opinions from
other people who have learned these languages *after* learning Python.

Oh...never mind. :-)

-- Lou Pecora (my views are my own) REMOVE THIS to email me.

**Michele Simionato** · Dec 11 '06, 04:35 PM

Re: alternate language

Bryan wrote:

what is a good alternate language to learn? i just want something to expand
my mind and hopefully reduce or delay any chance of alzheimer's. i would
especially like to hear from those of you who learned python _before_ these
languages.
>
haskell, erlang, ocaml, mozart/oz, rebel, etc.
>
i don't require any of these features, but extra browny points for any of
the following:
>
interactive interpreter
batteries included
can integrate with c
compiles to native code
can use a gui toolkit such as wx
doesn't take 60 hour weeks over years to master
>

Chicken Scheme: http://www.call-with-current-continuation.org
(not sure about wx, but there are various GUI wrappers available)

Michele Simionato

**Grant Edwards** · Dec 11 '06, 06:15 PM

Re: alternate language

On 2006-12-11, Aahz <aahz@pythoncra ft.comwrote:

Um... I think the original poster is saying that he already knows Python
and wants to learn another language. He particularly wants opinions from
other people who have learned these languages *after* learning Python.

There are people who learn another language after learning Python??

--
Grant Edwards grante Yow! The Korean War must
at have been fun.
visi.com

**Aahz** · Dec 11 '06, 06:35 PM

Re: alternate language

In article <12nr93mis39tu4 5@corp.supernew s.com>,
Grant Edwards <grante@visi.co mwrote:

>On 2006-12-11, Aahz <aahz@pythoncra ft.comwrote:

>>
>Um... I think the original poster is saying that he already knows Python
>and wants to learn another language. He particularly wants opinions from
>other people who have learned these languages *after* learning Python.

>
>There are people who learn another language after learning Python??

Heh. Taking your post more seriously than it deserves, don't you think
someone ought to learn at least SQL if they don't already know it when
they learn Python?
--
Aahz (aahz@pythoncra ft.com) <* http://www.pythoncraft.com/

Member of the Groucho Marx Fan Club

**Pekka Karjalainen** · Dec 11 '06, 07:05 PM

Re: alternate language

In article <elk9j7$rq2$1@p anix3.panix.com >, Aahz wrote:

>In article <12nr93mis39tu4 5@corp.supernew s.com>,
>Grant Edwards <grante@visi.co mwrote:

>>On 2006-12-11, Aahz <aahz@pythoncra ft.comwrote:

>>>
>>Um... I think the original poster is saying that he already knows Python
>>and wants to learn another language. He particularly wants opinions from
>>other people who have learned these languages *after* learning Python.

>>
>>There are people who learn another language after learning Python??

>
>Heh. Taking your post more seriously than it deserves, don't you think
>someone ought to learn at least SQL if they don't already know it when
>they learn Python?
>--
>Aahz (aahz@pythoncra ft.com) <* http://www.pythoncraft.com/
>
>Member of the Groucho Marx Fan Club

**Pekka Karjalainen** · Dec 11 '06, 07:05 PM

Re: alternate language

In article <slrnenrbko.hhk .pkarjala@paju. oulu.fi>, Pekka Karjalainen wrote:
<nothing>

Sorry, I messed up the attribution when editing and decided not to
post. Accidentally did post an empty message anyway.

I was going to recommend Haskell for the original poster too, and I wanted
to answer that I did indeed (start to) learn another language after
Python. Haskell is mind-expanding after all. I'm not sure which directions
mine has expanded, because I have so much difficulty with slrn today, but
never mind.

I won't repeat the Haskell recommendation I typed up and then deleted. If
you look at what people say about it you either want to try it or not.

Pka

**Grant Edwards** · Dec 12 '06, 02:15 AM

Re: alternate language

On 2006-12-11, Aahz <aahz@pythoncra ft.comwrote:

Grant Edwards <grante@visi.co mwrote:

>>Um... I think the original poster is saying that he already knows Python
>>and wants to learn another language. He particularly wants opinions from
>>other people who have learned these languages *after* learning Python.

>>
>>There are people who learn another language after learning Python??

>
Heh. Taking your post more seriously than it deserves,

It was intended as a joke. :)

don't you think someone ought to learn at least SQL if they
don't already know it when they learn Python?

More seriously, I would have suggested Scheme, Prolog, Smalltalk, and possibly
APL -- but those are all pretty old-school.

--
Grant Edwards
grante@visi.com

**Aahz** · Dec 12 '06, 04:35 AM

Re: alternate language

In article <12ns5pea5d84f4 a@corp.supernew s.com>,
Grant Edwards <grante@visi.co mwrote:

>On 2006-12-11, Aahz <aahz@pythoncra ft.comwrote:

>Grant Edwards <grante@visi.co mwrote:

>>>
>>>There are people who learn another language after learning Python??

>>
>Heh. Taking your post more seriously than it deserves,

>
>It was intended as a joke. :)

Yeah, yeah, that's what they all say.
--
Aahz (aahz@pythoncra ft.com) <* http://www.pythoncraft.com/

Member of the Groucho Marx Fan Club

**Florian Diesch** · Dec 15 '06, 05:05 PM

Re: alternate language

Bryan <belred@gmail.c omwrote:

what is a good alternate language to learn? i just want something to
expand my mind and hopefully reduce or delay any chance of
alzheimer's. i would especially like to hear from those of you who
learned python _before_ these languages.
>
haskell, erlang, ocaml, mozart/oz, rebel, etc.

I did a little bit Haskell at university. IMHO it's a very interesting
language to expand your mind. I never used it for real programming
though.

i don't require any of these features, but extra browny points for any
of the following:
>
interactive interpreter

HUGS

batteries included

Not with the standard library but AFAIK GHC comes with alot of things

can integrate with c

AFAIK there are some tools

compiles to native code

GHC

can use a gui toolkit such as wx

AFAIK there are at least Gtk bindings

doesn't take 60 hour weeks over years to master

It may take you some time get the idea of pure functional programming
(no loops, no assignment, ...)

Florian
--
<http://www.florian-diesch.de/>

alternate language

alternate language

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