Python / scheme implement

[Vent d'Est - East Wind]

Can somebody tell me what s exactly the difference beetween scheme and
python languages

i m thiking to learn one of them but i m not sure wich one

somebody told me python is better and have much library
somebody told me scheme is much smarter and have nice structure

i also see a project about a scheme/python implementation
here is the url

http://plt-spy.sourceforge.net/home.html

i m not sure what s really but seems cool if someone know more about it
or have some concrete exemple it can be more understable

i m not sure what to do
ps i want programming some open source soft for network with gui


thankx a lot

east wind

[Daniel Yoo]

Re: Python / scheme implement

Vent d'Est - East Wind <po-yung.liu@pandor a.be> wrote:
: Can somebody tell me what s exactly the difference beetween scheme and
: python languages

: i m thiking to learn one of them but i m not sure wich one

: somebody told me python is better and have much library
: somebody told me scheme is much smarter and have nice structure

Hello!


What programming language experience do you already have?


If you're looking for Scheme learning resources, you may want to look
at the PLT web site:

http://www.plt-scheme.org/

In particular, the Scheme folks have written a few books for learning
the language; the link above has an online version of "How to Design
Programs", which is an excellent book. Another great book whose
implementation language is Scheme is "The Structure And Interpretation
of Computer Programs":

http://mitpress.mit.edu/sicp/



On the Python side, you may want to look at:

http://www.python.org/topics/learn/

If you are a beginner to programming, visit:

http://www.python.org/topics/learn/non-prog.html

which includes links to introductory programming tutorials.



: i also see a project about a scheme/python implementation
: here is the url
: http://plt-spy.sourceforge.net/home.html
: i m not sure what s really but seems cool if someone know more about it
: or have some concrete exemple it can be more understable

If you are interested in the other direction, I have a weak Scheme
interpreter that's written in Python:

http://hkn.eecs.berkeley.edu/~dyoo/python/pyscheme/

It's not perfect (and frankly, is a little outdated!), but it's a
proof-of-concept that one language can model the other.


Personally, I like both languages, so my advice would be to look at
them both. (But perhaps not at the same time... *grin*)


Good luck to you!

[Vent d'Est - East Wind]

Re: Python / scheme implement

Daniel Yoo wrote:[color=blue]
> Vent d'Est - East Wind <po-yung.liu@pandor a.be> wrote:
> : Can somebody tell me what s exactly the difference beetween scheme and
> : python languages
>
> : i m thiking to learn one of them but i m not sure wich one
>
> : somebody told me python is better and have much library
> : somebody told me scheme is much smarter and have nice structure
>
> Hello!
>
>
> What programming language experience do you already have?
>[/color]

beginner i like script-fu and python-fu in gimp but it s not the only
soft to do i m think to write a network gui soft
i have some problem with scheme on my debian

Running the PLT installer...
../bin/mzscheme: relocation error: ./bin/mzscheme: symbol
__libc_stack_en d, version GLIBC_2.1 not defined in file ld-linux.so.2
with link time reference
Error: PLT installer failed.

i installed one on my windows and work fine but i dont want to stay to
long on windows because too buggy too unstable and to virus
and i begin learn linux it s quite cool


[color=blue]
>
> If you're looking for Scheme learning resources, you may want to look
> at the PLT web site:
>
> http://www.plt-scheme.org/[/color]

yeah i saw it thankx[color=blue]
>
> In particular, the Scheme folks have written a few books for learning
> the language; the link above has an online version of "How to Design
> Programs", which is an excellent book. Another great book whose
> implementation language is Scheme is "The Structure And Interpretation
> of Computer Programs":
>
> http://mitpress.mit.edu/sicp/
>
>[/color]
i see some free ebook in html format but seems difficult
i think to begin with these book if i do scheme Little Schemer and
Seasonned Scheme from Mit press
unfortunatly still not free edition so i will surely buy on amazon.com


[color=blue]
>
> On the Python side, you may want to look at:
>
> http://www.python.org/topics/learn/
>
> If you are a beginner to programming, visit:
>
> http://www.python.org/topics/learn/non-prog.html
>
> which includes links to introductory programming tutorials.
>
>
>
> : i also see a project about a scheme/python implementation
> : here is the url
> : http://plt-spy.sourceforge.net/home.html
> : i m not sure what s really but seems cool if someone know more about it
> : or have some concrete exemple it can be more understable
>
> If you are interested in the other direction, I have a weak Scheme
> interpreter that's written in Python:
>
> http://hkn.eecs.berkeley.edu/~dyoo/python/pyscheme/
>
> It's not perfect (and frankly, is a little outdated!), but it's a
> proof-of-concept that one language can model the other.
>[/color]
your soft seems very intersting but i m too beginner for understand it
good in fact but in future can be cool

[color=blue]
>
> Personally, I like both languages, so my advice would be to look at
> them both. (But perhaps not at the same time... *grin*)
>[/color]
it s also why i cant choice ok i choice to learn them both if not same
times wich ones first ??

[color=blue]
>
> Good luck to you![/color]


THANKXX for your precious advis i m gratefull to your hint

[510046470588-0001@t-online.de]

Re: Python / scheme implement

Daniel Yoo <dyoo@hkn.eecs. berkeley.edu> writes:[color=blue]
> It's not perfect (and frankly, is a little outdated!), but it's a
> proof-of-concept that one language can model the other.[/color]

how does python model call-with-current-continuation?


Klaus Schilling

[Daniel Yoo]

Re: Python / scheme implement

510046470588-0001@t-online.de wrote:
: Daniel Yoo <dyoo@hkn.eecs. berkeley.edu> writes:
:> It's not perfect (and frankly, is a little outdated!), but it's a
:> proof-of-concept that one language can model the other.

: how does python model call-with-current-continuation?


Hi Klaus,

I'm not sure if you meant that question to be a challenge, but I'll
take it up! *grin*


The question is slightly off: there's nothing about Python in
particular that prevents us from implementing call/cc. It does,
however, take a bit of work: implementing call/cc involves a rewrite
of the interpreter into a CPS form.


It's actually not too bad, and I have now done this. As a nice side
effect, we also get proper tail recursion! Hurrah!

You can take a look at the updated code here:

http://hkn.eecs.berkeley.edu/~dyoo/python/pyscheme/pyscheme-1.5pre.tar.gz

For example:

;;;;;;
volado:~/Documents/work/pyscheme/trunk/src dyoo$ python scheme.py
Welcome to PyScheme! Type: (QUIT) to quit.

[PyScheme] >>> (+ 1 (call/cc (lambda (k) (+ 2 (k 3)))))
4
;;;;;;


The improvements are due to ideas I stole from Shriram Krishnamurthi's
"Programmin g Languages: Application and Interpretation" :

http://www.cs.brown.edu/~sk/Publications/Books/ProgLangs/

and Friedman, Wand, and Haynes "Essentials of Programming Languages":

http://www.cs.indiana.edu/eip/eopl.html

I'm psyched now: I think I finally understand continuations! *grin*


I do have to fix a major bug with pair representation in pyscheme.
But as soon as I get that outstanding fixed, I'll send a more formal
announcement.


Hope this helps!