PHP Dating Script

[fbionyourtail]

Been looking for a good PHP based dating script that is reasonably
priced for a while. Several come close but are unfinished. I've
already been burned by scripts almost done and then a complete breach
of contract where the author dumps the site, no word to the
purchasers, and then starts selling it elsewhere under a different
domain (hello Ronald James aka RJ selling "Matchmaker Pro" -- don't by
it -- it's copy protected too -- you'll be sorry if you invest
anything even in the basic)

Promises, etc. I'm thinking that a very good dating script should be
able to be purchased for $200-500. You can get excellent
content management systems, vbulletin, and a whole lot of other
scripts which provide many more features than your basic dating script
for a whole lot less. I've seen promises of a great script for
$1,600 because you don't have to hire your own programmer -- yes, and
I don't want to pay that much for a script everyone else has on their
site too which is part of the economy of scale. Ridiculous. Another
one is being sold at $700, still way too much. None of these places
have been able to point me to people that actually paid for these
scripts and are running even half successful web sites. Always
themselves under different names and domains.

My guess is whomever makes a reasonably good dating script and sells
it for $300 will be raking it in. I will not touch the scripts that
cost 300+ that require zend optimizer since this leaves the purchaser
in hell when you discover bugs or company disappears and it's money
thrown out the window. It has happened way too often before.

Anyone working on a project like this? I've started but I'm an amateur
php programmer. Perhaps I'll have it done soon...

[.:Ninja]

Re: PHP Dating Script

fbionyourtail wrote:
[color=blue]
> Been looking for a good PHP based dating script that is reasonably
> priced for a while. Several come close but are unfinished. I've
> already been burned by scripts almost done and then a complete breach
> of contract where the author dumps the site, no word to the
> purchasers, and then starts selling it elsewhere under a different
> domain (hello Ronald James aka RJ selling "Matchmaker Pro" -- don't by
> it -- it's copy protected too -- you'll be sorry if you invest
> anything even in the basic)[/color]
[color=blue]
> Anyone working on a project like this? I've started but I'm an amateur
> php programmer. Perhaps I'll have it done soon...[/color]

Yes, it's what I spend most of my evenings doing. I can tell you this much
though, I'm not selling my "script" (really, it's a full featured program
with a web front end), not even for $1000. No. I have worked too hard, had
too many sleepless nights and frustrations to just give it away for next to
nothing. From that viewpoint, how much soul do you think people put into
programs they sell, especially in a language any kid can master? If you
really want to buy such a program, choose a company with references, one
with a tractable history - a reputable one. If such a company does not
exist, such as in my experience, you're way better off investing the two or
three months writing your own program.

Just my 2c :)

--

http://www.ninja.up.ac.za

[FLEB]

Re: PHP Dating Script

Regarding this well-known quote, often attributed to fbionyourtail's famous
"Tue, 25 May 2004 22:05:33 -0400" speech:
[color=blue]
> Been looking for a good PHP based dating script that is reasonably
> priced for a while. Several come close but are unfinished. I've
> already been burned by scripts almost done and then a complete breach
> of contract where the author dumps the site, no word to the
> purchasers, and then starts selling it elsewhere under a different
> domain (hello Ronald James aka RJ selling "Matchmaker Pro" -- don't by
> it -- it's copy protected too -- you'll be sorry if you invest
> anything even in the basic)
>
> Promises, etc. I'm thinking that a very good dating script should be
> able to be purchased for $200-500. You can get excellent
> content management systems, vbulletin, and a whole lot of other
> scripts which provide many more features than your basic dating script
> for a whole lot less. I've seen promises of a great script for
> $1,600 because you don't have to hire your own programmer -- yes, and
> I don't want to pay that much for a script everyone else has on their
> site too which is part of the economy of scale. Ridiculous. Another
> one is being sold at $700, still way too much. None of these places
> have been able to point me to people that actually paid for these
> scripts and are running even half successful web sites. Always
> themselves under different names and domains.
>
> My guess is whomever makes a reasonably good dating script and sells
> it for $300 will be raking it in. I will not touch the scripts that
> cost 300+ that require zend optimizer since this leaves the purchaser
> in hell when you discover bugs or company disappears and it's money
> thrown out the window. It has happened way too often before.
>
> Anyone working on a project like this? I've started but I'm an amateur
> php programmer. Perhaps I'll have it done soon...[/color]

I don't know any scripts, but I imagine the higher cost comes from the fact
that vastly more people/sites use things like a CMS, a BBS, or a chatroom.
Likewise, more people just invest the time and write them, leading to a
glut of these in the marketplace. A matchmaking suite, however is a niche
market and, as you found, you'll end up paying more either in time or money
to get one.

--
-- Rudy Fleminger
-- sp@mmers.and.ev il.ones.will.bo w-down-to.us
(put "Hey!" in the Subject line for priority processing!)
-- http://www.pixelsaredead.com

[fbionyourtail]

Re: PHP Dating Script

On Wed, 26 May 2004 15:57:42 -0400, FLEB
<soon.the.sp@mm ers.and.evil.on es.will.bow-down-to.us> wrote:
[color=blue]
>I don't know any scripts, but I imagine the higher cost comes from the fact
>that vastly more people/sites use things like a CMS, a BBS, or a chatroom.
>Likewise, more people just invest the time and write them, leading to a
>glut of these in the marketplace. A matchmaking suite, however is a niche
>market and, as you found, you'll end up paying more either in time or money
>to get one.[/color]

I don't disagree but to spend $1,600 on an average script up to $700
for one I can't even see implemented into large sites to see how it
works, at those prices it's better to hire someone to do it from
scratch and own it outright to do what you want. I don't know of
anyone willing to risk that kind of money to send to some programmer
who claims he has a business.... and how many reputable shops are
there on the net? Not many on Hotscripts, IMHO...

[Nikolai Chuvakhin]

Re: PHP Dating Script

fbionyourtail <fbionSPAMMYyou rtail@yahSPAMRE MOVoo.com> wrote
in message news:<vdu7b0h1r v85beuv8c0jsdi5 0af9ehm0c7@4ax. com>...[color=blue]
>
> Been looking for a good PHP based dating script that is reasonably
> priced for a while.[/color]

....
[color=blue]
> I'm thinking that a very good dating script should be
> able to be purchased for $200-500.[/color]

I think a reality check is in order here. A successful dating
resource has millions of members; for example, eHarmony recently
announced they've reached four million:

http://www.eharmony.com/core/eharmony?cmd=community-press-4million

According to an earlier press release, 24% of eHarmony members
are paying subscribers, which is more than three times the industry
average:

http://www.eharmony.com/core/eharmony?cmd=community-press-milestone

Assuming eHarmony charges about one million of its paying subscribers
$20 a month (actually, it's somewhat more than that), you are looking
at a MONTHLY revenue of about $20 million. Assuming no further growth,
a measly FFO margin of 10%, and a fairly aggressive 20% discount rate,
the value of eHarmony's future earnings as of today should be about
(20 * 12 * 10%) / 20% = $120 million. Assuming the necessary
infrastructure costs $100 million upfront (for reference, Google's
hardware expenditures were $37 million in 2002 and $177 million in
2003), the software can be valued as a call option with a spot price
of $120 million and strike price of $100 million. This option has
an intrinsic value of $20 million; its total value is even greater,
but depends on time to expiration and volatility assumptions. In
other words, under this set of assumptions, the software is worth
at least $20/$120 = 16.67% of the business.

To recap, any reasonable discussion of dating software should
probably start with 15-20% equity interest in your company.
Any cash compensation should be counted towards decreasing the
developer's equity interest. These are economic realities you
are facing...

Cheers,
NC

[fbionyourtail]

Re: PHP Dating Script

On 27 May 2004 15:00:50 -0700, nc@iname.com (Nikolai Chuvakhin) wrote:
[color=blue]
>fbionyourtai l <fbionSPAMMYyou rtail@yahSPAMRE MOVoo.com> wrote
> in message news:<vdu7b0h1r v85beuv8c0jsdi5 0af9ehm0c7@4ax. com>...[color=green]
>>
>> Been looking for a good PHP based dating script that is reasonably
>> priced for a while.[/color]
>
>...
>[color=green]
>> I'm thinking that a very good dating script should be
>> able to be purchased for $200-500.[/color]
>
>I think a reality check is in order here. A successful dating
>resource has millions of members; for example, eHarmony recently
>announced they've reached four million:
>
>http://www.eharmony.com/core/eharmon...press-4million
>
>According to an earlier press release, 24% of eHarmony members
>are paying subscribers, which is more than three times the industry
>average:
>
>http://www.eharmony.com/core/eharmon...ress-milestone
>
>Assuming eHarmony charges about one million of its paying subscribers
>$20 a month (actually, it's somewhat more than that), you are looking
>at a MONTHLY revenue of about $20 million. Assuming no further growth,
>a measly FFO margin of 10%, and a fairly aggressive 20% discount rate,
>the value of eHarmony's future earnings as of today should be about
>(20 * 12 * 10%) / 20% = $120 million. Assuming the necessary
>infrastructu re costs $100 million upfront (for reference, Google's
>hardware expenditures were $37 million in 2002 and $177 million in
>2003), the software can be valued as a call option with a spot price
>of $120 million and strike price of $100 million. This option has
>an intrinsic value of $20 million; its total value is even greater,
>but depends on time to expiration and volatility assumptions. In
>other words, under this set of assumptions, the software is worth
>at least $20/$120 = 16.67% of the business.
>
>To recap, any reasonable discussion of dating software should
>probably start with 15-20% equity interest in your company.
>Any cash compensation should be counted towards decreasing the
>developer's equity interest. These are economic realities you
>are facing...[/color]

????? Thanks for your reply but I think we are talking about a whole
other arena. The economic reality is that one thing has nothing to do
with another. If I'm looking to buy an office suite and I find MS
Office, I don't need to analyze my investments to know generally what
it should cost as in comparison to Wordperfect, etc. There is a market
for such applications and suites, not custom work.

I'm trying to reach a few thousand subscribers in a niche market
(maybe 50K - 100K at best at this point) and want to purchase a
premade script with reasonable quality. Webdate would have sufficed if
it wasn't copy protected and encoded (won't make the mistake of buying
such from small net companies.) If I want a content management system
for a small web site there are plenty available, e.g. articlemanager,
miraserver, etc. which will get the job done too. These are premade
scripts, generic, customizable, scales to a certain degree.

If I was seeking to duplicate eharmony or lava life and raised capital
to do so, I would never even think of messing around with any of the
generic scripts I mention above. In addition to support, I'd need a
script that scales well and performance optimized. That is a
completely different scenario and bears no resemblance to the reality
I and many other webmasters are attempting to accomplish.


Thanks for your reply. It is appreciated. But it does sound like the
stuff I used to get from the Harvard MBAs that worked for us when the
answer to a question was a simple yes or no!

[Nikolai Chuvakhin]

Re: PHP Dating Script

fbionyourtail <fbionSPAMMYyou rtail@yahSPAMRE MOVoo.com> wrote
in message news:<noddb0dq3 d6g1jr79mpkluei 6vbup0rq8d@4ax. com>...[color=blue]
>
> ????? Thanks for your reply but I think we are talking about
> a whole other arena.[/color]

I respectfully disagree. Fundamentally, you are in the same
arena as eHarmony or LavaLife; you attempt to make money
by charging your users a fee for access to certain data via
an Internet-based application. True, you expect to operate
on a smaller scale, but you are trying to create a money-making
venture nevertheless...
[color=blue]
> If I'm looking to buy an office suite and I find MS Office,
> I don't need to analyze my investments to know generally what
> it should cost as in comparison to Wordperfect, etc. There is
> a market for such applications and suites, not custom work.[/color]

Exactly. Just look at the thread you and I are debating in.
Your original post is dated 2004-05-25 19:35:18 PST on Google
Groups. Your reply to my reply is dated 2004-05-27 21:50:19 PST.
So your original post has been in cyberspace for good 50 hours,
but you haven't received a single hint as to availablility of
that which you are looking for. Normally, when people ask
about other things -- development environments, graphing
packages, e-mail handling, PDF/Word/Excel files generation,
content management systems, and many, many others -- in this
newsgroup, they get numerous pointers within a few hours. So
your statement "there is a market for such applications and
suites" certainly holds for office packages, but flies in the
face of reality for dating suites.

I know at least one other area which is similarly void of market
supply in the PHP world -- statistics. I am aware of only one
PHP package capable of estimating a multiple regression; it has
been developed by Elmer Wiens in Vancouver and is not available
for either free download or sale. So when I needed my own
multiple regression estimation tool, I had to port it from
Fortran (thank goodness for The Royal Statistical Society and
its journal, Applied Statistics). To make things worse, Elmer
Wiens' package runs the traditional minimum sum of squared
errors regression (his implementation is based on the Householder
algorithm, if I remember correctly), "mine" (in quotes, since
I by and large copied the work of Subhash Narula and John
Wellington) estimates minimum sum of absolute errors regression,
which presumably works better for economic and financial time
series...
[color=blue]
> I'm trying to reach a few thousand subscribers in a niche
> market (maybe 50K - 100K at best at this point) and want
> to purchase a premade script with reasonable quality.[/color]

I think by now we have established that it's not available.
[color=blue]
> Webdate would have sufficed if it wasn't copy protected and
> encoded[/color]

Note the similarity with multiple regression packages... Only
one product out there, and even that is not available in the
desired form.
[color=blue]
> Thanks for your reply. It is appreciated. But it does sound
> like the stuff I used to get from the Harvard MBAs[/color]

I was actually hoping you'd say Stanford or MIT... :)

Cheers,
NC

[Vic]

Re: PHP Dating Script

fbionyourtail <fbionSPAMMYyou rtail@yahSPAMRE MOVoo.com> wrote in message news:<1l1ab01q8 hpmcv2tgncigkj8 nd2t5jq9vs@4ax. com>...[color=blue]
> I don't disagree but to spend $1,600 on an average script up to $700
> for one I can't even see implemented into large sites to see how it
> works, at those prices it's better to hire someone to do it from
> scratch and own it outright to do what you want.[/color]

I don't think $1,600 is very much for bespoke software. If
you assume the developer charges $40 (a very reason rate,
but I don't want to start a discussion about this) per
hour then that only pays for 40 hours worth of work, less
than a week of work!. Take away time for requirements capture
and documentation and testing the there is little time for
actual development. Skip the non implementation tasks and
your software is simply not going to be at a professional
standard.

Anyone willing to base a buisness on software knocked up in
a week is likely to be disappointed. Learning to do it
yourself and investing your time is the only way I can think
of doing it on the cheap. Or hire someone to do a real
good job and sell it on to recoup your costs.

Vic
--