How to avoid opening a new window with the shift key?

[Robert]

Re: How to avoid opening a new window with the shift key?

> > > The right button of the[color=blue][color=green][color=darkred]
> > > mouse also is disabled. This is the reason.[/color][/color]
>[/color]
Here is how a user can reenable the right mouse button.

"riki" <riki_fox@hotma il.com> wrote in message news:<c3e1ii$c7 a$1@ls219.htnet .hr>...
[color=blue]
> and disable right click[/color]

See this article for two additonal ways to re-enable the mouse button:

http://groups.google.com/groups?q=enable+the+right+mouse+button+group:comp.lang.javascript&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&scoring=d&selm=9urqah%24a7f%240%40216.155.33.99&rnum=4

I've copied one below too. I think it is so interensting that you can
run Javascript from the command line.

Robert

"Grant Wagner" <gwagner@agrico reunited.com> wrote in message news:3C113D55.E 5F0B3FA@agricor eunited.com...[color=blue]
> ~greg wrote:
>
> If by "bookmarkle t" you mean a Favorite that executes code via the
> javascript: psuedo-protocol[/color]

<snip>

This works!
javascript:func tion a(){document.bo dy.oncontextmen u=null;document .onmousedown=nu ll;window.onmou sedown=null;}a( );

thanks,
~greg

All the user has to do is bookmark this javascript line an run it by
clicking on the bookmark.

You may not like the advise, but you are not accomplishing what you
expect from disabling the keys because the user can get around your
limits. Thus whatever you are trying to protect is exposed.

Robert

[Andrew Thompson]

Re: How to avoid opening a new window with the shift key?

On 18 May 2004 11:07:43 -0700, Lee wrote:
[color=blue]
> If somebody asks the best technique to use to clean a shotgun
> without unloading it, would you be doing them a service by
> figuring out some solution that might work, if they're very
> careful?[/color]

LOL - potential sig. material..

[ And assuming no-one else was in line-of
splatter of the shotgun, I'd probably give
them an answer, ..and let Darwinian selection
sort it out. ;-) ]

--
Andrew Thompson
http://www.PhySci.org/ Open-source software suite
http://www.PhySci.org/codes/ Web & IT Help
http://www.1point1C.org/ Science & Technology

[Julie]

Re: How to avoid opening a new window with the shift key?

Richard Cornford wrote:[color=blue][color=green]
> > But, having multiple followups all telling the OP that they are dumb
> > to even think about doing what they're doing, all making the
> > assumption that the OP is too stupid to know it's probably a bad idea
> > to do this in an internet environment, is elitist behavior that
> > reduces the effectiveness of the group. IMO.[/color]
>
> I can see why you may feel that it elitist to recognise and point out
> fundamentally flawed design, but your personal standards are not those
> of the majority of the regulars on this group.[/color]

They aren't personal standards -- they are a part of living in a civilized
society -- empower the individual.

There is no majority rule that pertains to this forum.

[Julie]

Re: How to avoid opening a new window with the shift key?

Richard Cornford wrote:[color=blue]
>
> Julie wrote:
> <snip>[color=green]
> > Honestly, it doesn't matter whether or not the intended target is
> > intranet, internet, or anything else. The OP had a specific
> > question, and respondents felt that (for whatever reason) it was
> > their prerogative to provide advice, commentary, and critiques.[/color]
> <snip>
>
> So long as responses are on-topic for the group then it _is_ their
> prerogative to provide advice, commentary and critiques. That is Usenet;
> open, public and free.
>
> If you want the right to demand specific answers to specific questions
> then you should expect to pay for those answers, otherwise you will get
> what you get.[/color]

So you feel that it is inappropriate for someone to expect and answer to a
question, but more appropriate for respondents to separately arrive at
unfounded conclusions and provide unsubstantiated and unwarranted critiques?

[Julie]

Re: How to avoid opening a new window with the shift key?

Lee wrote:[color=blue]
>
> Julie said:[color=green]
> >
> >Randy Webb wrote:[color=darkred]
> >>
> >> Carlos Andr?s wrote:
> >> > This web is an internal application and my company have decided that
> >> > this function doesn't work in the application. The right button of the
> >> > mouse also is disabled. This is the reason.
> >> >
> >> > I was looking for some help but I've only found critiques.
> >>
> >> No, you got advice. And then you come back and say "oh, its for an
> >> intranet app", which is fine. But the default assumption is its for the
> >> web, and on the web, the answers you got are the only answers to get.[/color]
> >
> >He didn't ask for advice, he asked for answers.
> >
> >If respondents could simply answer the question (presuming that they _have_ an
> >answer), and leave the critiques and advice for later, it sure would make it
> >easier to get _answers_ to questions.
> >
> >Honestly, it doesn't matter whether or not the intended target is intranet,
> >internet, or anything else. The OP had a specific question, and respondents
> >felt that (for whatever reason) it was their prerogative to provide advice,
> >commentary, and critiques.[/color]
>
> And, of course, that is their prerogative, and that's a good
> thing, because very often advice, commentary and critiques
> are more valuable than answering the original question.
>
> If somebody asks the best technique to use to clean a shotgun
> without unloading it, would you be doing them a service by
> figuring out some solution that might work, if they're very
> careful?[/color]

I don't see why not? Are you self-presuming some level of authority and
capacity or control over the individual asking the question? Protect them from
themselves?
[color=blue]
> Badly written web applications damage the reputations of all
> web application developers.[/color]

I don't disagree.

However, I'd be very interested to know how you were able to determine that
that it was a 'badly written web application' strictly from:

I've got a problem. I'd like to avoid opening a new window
when you have pressed the shift key and you click in the
left button of the mouse.

Either you have incredible powers of targeted analysis and reasoning, or you
made an assumption.

[Lee]

Re: How to avoid opening a new window with the shift key?

Julie said:[color=blue]
>
>Richard Cornford wrote:[color=green][color=darkred]
>> > But, having multiple followups all telling the OP that they are dumb
>> > to even think about doing what they're doing, all making the
>> > assumption that the OP is too stupid to know it's probably a bad idea
>> > to do this in an internet environment, is elitist behavior that
>> > reduces the effectiveness of the group. IMO.[/color]
>>
>> I can see why you may feel that it elitist to recognise and point out
>> fundamentally flawed design, but your personal standards are not those
>> of the majority of the regulars on this group.[/color]
>
>They aren't personal standards -- they are a part of living in a civilized
>society -- empower the individual.[/color]

Our civilized society empowers us to choose not to help people
to create designs that we believe are bad.

[Lee]

Re: How to avoid opening a new window with the shift key?

Julie said:[color=blue]
>
>Lee wrote:[/color]
[color=blue][color=green]
>> If somebody asks the best technique to use to clean a shotgun
>> without unloading it, would you be doing them a service by
>> figuring out some solution that might work, if they're very
>> careful?[/color]
>
>I don't see why not?[/color]

Because it would be irresponsible.

Main Entry: ir·re·spon·si·b le
Pronunciation: "ir-i-'spän(t)-s&-b&l
Function: adjective : not responsible: as
a : not answerable to higher authority <an irresponsible dictatorship>
b : said or done with no sense of responsibility <irresponsibl e accusations>
c : lacking a sense of responsibility
d : unable especially mentally or financially to bear responsibility

[color=blue][color=green]
>> Badly written web applications damage the reputations of all
>> web application developers.[/color]
>
>I don't disagree.
>
>However, I'd be very interested to know how you were able to determine that
>that it was a 'badly written web application' strictly from:
>
> I've got a problem. I'd like to avoid opening a new window
> when you have pressed the shift key and you click in the
> left button of the mouse.
>
>Either you have incredible powers of targeted analysis and reasoning, or you
>made an assumption.[/color]

It is completely reasonable to assume that any application that
requires standard controls to be disabled is badly written.

The poster always has the opportunity to appeal that decision
by giving more information.

On the other hand, once we have helped somebody to create a bad
application, we have no such appeal process to prevent them from
deploying it.

[Julie]

Re: How to avoid opening a new window with the shift key?

Lee wrote:[color=blue]
> It is completely reasonable to assume that any application that
> requires standard controls to be disabled is badly written.[/color]

You pointed out our own problem -- 'assume'.

It isn't reasonable to assume.

[kaeli]

Re: How to avoid opening a new window with the shift key?

In article <40AA62AB.10018 4F7@nospam.com> , julie@nospam.co m enlightened
us with...[color=blue]
>
> However, I'd be very interested to know how you were able to determine that
> that it was a 'badly written web application' strictly from:
>
> I've got a problem. I'd like to avoid opening a new window
> when you have pressed the shift key and you click in the
> left button of the mouse.
>
> Either you have incredible powers of targeted analysis and reasoning, or you
> made an assumption.
>[/color]

Because by definition, any WEB (read: internet) application that
requires the disabling of standard controls used by people with
disabilities is badly written.
It is assumed in this group (by the majority of active posters) that any
question pertains to internet usage unless otherwise stated (which the
OP did not). In fact, the FAQ for this group explicitly states such.

Hey, if you want to help people write crap, feel free. Some of us prefer
to point out flaws with the assumption that no one would code flaws on
purpose. I know the people on this group have helped me correct flaws I
didn't know about. Instead of getting pissy, I said something a little
more appropriate. I said "thank you".

--
--
~kaeli~
A bicycle can't stand on its own because it is two tired.

http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart

http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace

[Richard Cornford]

Re: How to avoid opening a new window with the shift key?

Julie wrote:[color=blue]
> Lee wrote:[/color]
<snip>[color=blue][color=green]
>> If somebody asks the best technique to use to clean a shotgun
>> without unloading it, would you be doing them a service by
>> figuring out some solution that might work, if they're very
>> careful?[/color]
>
> I don't see why not? Are you self-presuming some level of
> authority and capacity or control over the individual asking
> the question? Protect them from themselves?[/color]

Where is the presumption of authority? If Lee decides he does not want
to encourage someone to take a cause of action that he considers stands
a reasonable chance of resulting in that individual shooting themselves
in the foot (or worse) then he is at liberty not to encourage them.
[color=blue][color=green]
>> Badly written web applications damage the reputations of all
>> web application developers.[/color]
>
> I don't disagree.
>
> However, I'd be very interested to know how you were able to
> determine that that it was a 'badly written web application'
> strictly from:
>
> I've got a problem. I'd like to avoid opening a new window
> when you have pressed the shift key and you click in the
> left button of the mouse.
>
> Either you have incredible powers of targeted analysis and
> reasoning, or you made an assumption.[/color]

There is no great deduction involved. There are at least half a dozen
ways of getting a web browser to open a link (or even the current page)
in a new window; that is normal and expected behaviour from browsers. An
application operating over HTTP does not have to find the opening of a
link in a new window to be a problem, it should have been authored to
take into account the normal behaviour of web browsers (and the nature
of the HTTP protocol).

A desire to inhibit any aspect of normal browser behaviour implies that
undesirable consequences will follow from their use. So an expression of
any concern about (or even interest in) the fact that a browser may open
a link in a new window implies that the back-end has not been authored
to an appropriate standard for the context of its use (over HTTP with a
web browser client).

With appropriate back-end design the question would never be asked, so
deductions can be made from no more than the fact that it was.

Richard.

[Richard Cornford]

Re: How to avoid opening a new window with the shift key?

Julie wrote:
<snip>[color=blue]
> So you feel that it is inappropriate for someone to expect and answer
> to a question, but more appropriate for respondents to separately
> arrive at unfounded conclusions and provide unsubstantiated and
> unwarranted critiques?[/color]

Do you have any grounds for asserting that the conclusions were
unfounded or the critiques unsubstantiated or unwarranted? As I read the
OP, the information provided elicited the appropriate and expected
response. That response may have been modified if the OP had bothered to
provide all of the information pertinent to the question up front, but
not substantially.

Richard.

[Lasse Reichstein Nielsen]

Re: How to avoid opening a new window with the shift key?

Julie <julie@nospam.c om> writes:
[color=blue]
> You pointed out our own problem -- 'assume'.
>
> It isn't reasonable to assume.[/color]

Of course it is. Everybody does it all the time. You assume that we
understand the words that you use, right? Why? Because it's reasonable.

Long time readers of this group has learned what to assume from new
posters. It's not assumptions caught out of thin air, but based on
experience. Yes, the assumptions can fail, but in the long run, making
these assumptions helps a lot of people faster than if they had to
explain their problems themselves (something most people are not
trained to do, and which is obviously not trivial).

These experience based assumptions are even codified in the FAQ (well,
at least some of them). Howeverm, we have also learned not to assume
that new posters have read the FAQ, even though it does answer
questions that are frequently asked :)

/L
--
Lasse Reichstein Nielsen - lrn@hotpop.com
DHTML Death Colors: <URL:http://www.infimum.dk/HTML/rasterTriangleD OM.html>
'Faith without judgement merely degrades the spirit divine.'

[Lee]

Re: How to avoid opening a new window with the shift key?

Julie said:[color=blue]
>
>Lee wrote:[color=green]
>> It is completely reasonable to assume that any application that
>> requires standard controls to be disabled is badly written.[/color]
>
>You pointed out our own problem -- 'assume'.
>
>It isn't reasonable to assume.[/color]

Certainly it is. You couldn't survive a day without assumptions.
What isn't reasonable is to treat an assumption as fact.

[Randy Webb]

Re: How to avoid opening a new window with the shift key?

Matt Kruse wrote:
[color=blue]
> Randy Webb wrote:
>[color=green][color=darkred]
>>>I was looking for some help but I've only found critiques.[/color]
>>
>>No, you got advice. And then you come back and say "oh, its for an
>>intranet app", which is fine. But the default assumption is its for
>>the web, and on the web, the answers you got are the only answers to
>>get.[/color]
>
>
> I think this is flawed thinking, and it's littering this newsgroup.[/color]

You think that the answer I gave was "flawed thinking"????

this was my response:

Then redesign your page so that it doesn't break when its opened in a
new window.

So would you care to explain how thats "flawed thinking"?

What happens if I right click and "Open in new window"?

[color=blue]
> The default assumption for a (well-worded) question should always be that
> the OP has a justified reason to do what he or she is trying to do, and is
> looking for an answer to the QUESTION, not general discussion on the
> correctness of their design decision. (In some cases, the posting style of
> the original post makes it obvious that the OP has no clue about what they
> are really asking).[/color]

And the very question that was asked made it obvious. The problem is not
in the browser, nor in the new window, its in the back-end that gets
screwed by a new window. Which leaves the *only* sensible answer to be
"redesign the site so that it doesn't break".

[color=blue]
> If someone has an answer to the original question, or can point the person
> in the right direction, and _then_ decides to also note that there are
> potential problems with the idea, then that's great.[/color]


To date, I have not yet seen you post a possible "answer" to his
question. Is that because you either:

a) do not have an answer
b) dont think it can be done
[color=blue]
> But, having multiple followups all telling the OP that they are dumb to even
> think about doing what they're doing, all making the assumption that the OP
> is too stupid to know it's probably a bad idea to do this in an internet
> environment, is elitist behavior that reduces the effectiveness of the
> group. IMO.[/color]

I never said he was "dumb to even try", nor did I make an assumption. I
fail to see how that makes me "elitist" in any sense of the word. Of
course, if you can post a better answer than what I did, then you are
welcome to do so.





--
Randy
Chance Favors The Prepared Mind
comp.lang.javas cript FAQ - http://jibbering.com/faq/

[Randy Webb]

Re: How to avoid opening a new window with the shift key?

Julie wrote:
[color=blue]
> Randy Webb wrote:
>[color=green]
>>Carlos Andr?s wrote:
>>[color=darkred]
>>>This web is an internal application and my company have decided that
>>>this function doesn't work in the application. The right button of the
>>>mouse also is disabled. This is the reason.
>>>
>>>I was looking for some help but I've only found critiques.[/color]
>>
>>No, you got advice. And then you come back and say "oh, its for an
>>intranet app", which is fine. But the default assumption is its for the
>>web, and on the web, the answers you got are the only answers to get.[/color]
>
>
> He didn't ask for advice, he asked for answers.[/color]

And he got an answer. Perhaps you should go back and re-read what I said.

[color=blue]
> If respondents could simply answer the question (presuming that they _have_ an
> answer), and leave the critiques and advice for later, it sure would make it
> easier to get _answers_ to questions.[/color]

I never did any of the things you are *assuming* that I did. I made a
statement which was the answer to his question, and then I asked a
question of my own.
[color=blue]
> Honestly, it doesn't matter whether or not the intended target is intranet,
> internet, or anything else. The OP had a specific question, and respondents
> felt that (for whatever reason) it was their prerogative to provide advice,
> commentary, and critiques.[/color]

Now thats where you are wrong. It *does* make a difference whether its
for an intranet or internet application. Try writing code that can write
to the file system and come back and tell me if you can do it on the
internet and whether you can do it on an intranet where you know the
browser to be IE with priveleges set to allow FileSystemObjec t access.
[color=blue]
>[color=green]
>>Since it is an intranet app, go to each PC and edit the registry and
>>remove the entry that deals with the browsers and the ability to
>>shift-click to open a new window.
>>
>>And read the FAQ, with regards to posting, providing information, and
>>posting replies (top-posting) and trimming.[/color]
>
>
> Respondents: read the original question, and answer _THAT_.[/color]

And to you: Go read my reply and READ it. While you are reading, you
might want to read your own replies in this thread, with respect to the
OP's question, and then look up the word "hypocrite" .


--
Randy
Chance Favors The Prepared Mind
comp.lang.javas cript FAQ - http://jibbering.com/faq/