setTimeout not executing form submit

[Lasse Reichstein Nielsen]

Re: setTimeout not executing form submit

Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@we b.de> writes:
[color=blue]
> ACK, though I would prefer
>
> setTimeout(func tion foo() { obj.method(); }, 2000);
>
> for backwards compatibility.[/color]

Depending on how much you care about backwarts compatability,
you might have to do:
setTimeout("glo bal.path.to.obj .method()",2000 );

I don't like writing code inside strings, for many of the same reasons
that I don't like using "eval", but IE 4 and NS 3 needs it.

Which browsers will not understand anonymous functions, but do
understand functional arguments to setTimeout? I don't know of any
on the Windows platform.

/L
--
Lasse Reichstein Nielsen - lrn@hotpop.com
DHTML Death Colors: <URL:http://www.infimum.dk/HTML/rasterTriangleD OM.html>
'Faith without judgement merely degrades the spirit divine.'

[Dr John Stockton]

Re: setTimeout not executing form submit

JRS: In article <40880612.20006 01@PointedEars. de>, seen in
news:comp.lang. javascript, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn
<PointedEars@we b.de> posted at Thu, 22 Apr 2004 19:51:14 :
[color=blue]
>BTW: Your From address violates Internet/NetNews standards.[/color]

I doubt it. Please quote the standard to which you refer.

By the way, Hunnish attitudes went quite out of fashion after 1914-1918.

If Thomas Lahn is your real name, and if a potential employer should
search the Net for it, then ISTM that he/she will discover the
unattractivenes s of your personality.

--
© John Stockton, Surrey, UK. ?@merlyn.demon. co.uk Turnpike v4.00 MIME ©
Web <URL:http://www.uwasa.fi/~ts/http/tsfaq.html> -> Timo Salmi: Usenet Q&A.
Web <URL:http://www.merlyn.demo n.co.uk/news-use.htm> : about usage of News.
No Encoding. Quotes before replies. Snip well. Write clearly. Don't Mail News.

[Jim Ley]

Re: setTimeout not executing form submit

On Wed, 21 Apr 2004 05:28:06 +0200, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn
<PointedEars@we b.de> wrote:
[color=blue]
> the IE-DOM does support
>function references from v5.0 on, but not additional arguments to date
>(IE 6.0 SP-1) --[/color]

There's no way it can since that would break compatibility with every
previous version of _IE_ remember IE's DOM methods are not tied to a
particular script language, and the 3rd parameter of setTimeout is the
language.

setTimeout is a lousy way to cause a delay in a DOM anyway.

Jim.
--
comp.lang.javas cript FAQ - http://jibbering.com/faq/

[Jim Ley]

Re: setTimeout not executing form submit

On Thu, 22 Apr 2004 19:26:06 +0200, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn
<PointedEars@we b.de> wrote:
[color=blue]
>setTimeout() is a method of the global object, so the object calling
>theFormSubmit( ) is always the global object.[/color]

no setTimeout is a method of the window object, it may not be the same
as the global object

win=window.open ('','a');
win.setTimeout( "alert(this.nam e)",100)

Jim.
--
comp.lang.javas cript FAQ - http://jibbering.com/faq/

[Jim Ley]

Re: setTimeout not executing form submit

On Fri, 23 Apr 2004 19:06:54 +0200, Lasse Reichstein Nielsen
<lrn@hotpop.com > wrote:
[color=blue]
>Which browsers will not understand anonymous functions, but do
>understand functional arguments to setTimeout? I don't know of any
>on the Windows platform.[/color]

ASV3 with its internal script engine will IIRC.

Jim.
--
comp.lang.javas cript FAQ - http://jibbering.com/faq/

[Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn]

Re: setTimeout not executing form submit

Lasse Reichstein Nielsen wrote:
[color=blue]
> Which browsers will not understand anonymous functions, but do
> understand functional arguments to setTimeout? I don't know of any
> on the Windows platform.[/color]

As for JavaScript, the definition of anonymous functions _using the
"function" operator_ is described to be possible since JavaScript 1.5.

<devedge.netsca pe.com/library/manuals/2000/javascript/1.5/reference/ops.html#106634 4>

It nevertheless works in Netscape 4.8 that is described to support
JavaScript 1.3 or 1.4 only.

Passing a Function object reference to setTimeout() is possible in
JavaScript 1.2 and 1.3 (the window object is removed from the core
language in v1.4):

<devedge.netsca pe.com/library/manuals/2000/javascript/1.3/reference/window.html#120 3758>


But the Gecko DOM Reference is misleading:

<http://www.mozilla.org/docs/dom/domref/dom_window_ref1 15.html#1021427 >

Gecko in fact supports both strings and Function object references as first
argument for setTimeout().


As for JScript, the "function" operator is _not specified_ (it is not even
specified that the function identifier may be omitted in the "function"
statement specification, if we assume that what is specified as operator
in ECMAScript 3 is considered a statement in JScript:

<http://msdn.microsoft. com/library/default.asp?url =/library/en-us/script56/html/js56jslrfjscrip tstatementstoc. asp>

) but working as supposed in IE 5.01 SP2 (NT version) with JScript 5.1.5010
and IE 6.0 SP2 (Win2k) with JScript 5.6.8513. I would be glad if someone
who has IE < 5 installed would test this.

The MS implementation of setTimeout() takes a Function object reference
(described as "function pointer") from IE version 5 on:

<http://msdn.microsoft. com/library/default.asp?url =/workshop/author/dhtml/dhtml_node_entr y.asp>

Tested successfully with both of the above UAs/script engines.


Opera 6.05+ supports both features.


HTH

PointedEars

[Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn]

Re: setTimeout not executing form submit

Jim Ley wrote:
[color=blue]
> [...] Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn [...] wrote:[color=green]
>> the IE-DOM does support function references from v5.0 on, but not
>> additional arguments to date (IE 6.0 SP-1) --[/color]
>
> There's no way it can since that would break compatibility with every
> previous version of _IE_[/color]

Why? Scripts for previous versions would not use the third argument.
[color=blue]
> remember IE's DOM methods are not tied to a particular script language,
> and the 3rd parameter of setTimeout is the language.[/color]

If the script engine does not support the additional feature that's OK, but
there are other examples (take try...catch..fi nally or non-greedy RegExp
quantifiers) where this was done.
[color=blue]
> setTimeout is a lousy way to cause a delay in a DOM anyway.[/color]

Are you proposing a sleep() method instead, blocking the UA when called?


PointedEars

[Lasse Reichstein Nielsen]

Re: setTimeout not executing form submit

Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@we b.de> writes:
[color=blue]
> Are you proposing a sleep() method instead, blocking the UA when called?[/color]

That would probably be what most people really want.
It doesn't have to block the UA, just the current execution context.
It should then resume executing after the time us up, or at least
as soon as no other scheduled execution is running. It could work.

/L
--
Lasse Reichstein Nielsen - lrn@hotpop.com
DHTML Death Colors: <URL:http://www.infimum.dk/HTML/rasterTriangleD OM.html>
'Faith without judgement merely degrades the spirit divine.'

[optimistx]

Re: setTimeout not executing form submit

Dr John Stockton wrote:[color=blue]
> JRS: In article <40880612.20006 01@PointedEars. de>, seen in
> news:comp.lang. javascript, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn
> <PointedEars@we b.de> posted at Thu, 22 Apr 2004 19:51:14 :
>
>[color=green]
>>BTW: Your From address violates Internet/NetNews standards.[/color]
>
>
> I doubt it. Please quote the standard to which you refer.
>
> By the way, Hunnish attitudes went quite out of fashion after 1914-1918.
>
> If Thomas Lahn is your real name, and if a potential employer should
> search the Net for it, then ISTM that he/she will discover the
> unattractivenes s of your personality.
>[/color]
It is easier to tolerate and understand astonishing features, if one
puts e.g. an expression 'asperger syndrome' to google.com and reads some
key articles.

It helps me tolerate by imagining that my sick child would try to
continue his/her living here with the resources he/she has.

[Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn]

Re: setTimeout not executing form submit

optimistx wrote:[color=blue]
> Dr John Stockton wrote:[color=green]
>> Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@we b.de> posted:[color=darkred]
>>> BTW: Your From address violates Internet/NetNews standards.[/color]
>>
>> I doubt it. Please quote the standard to which you refer.[/color][/color]

| From: Michael Winter <M.Winter@bluey onder.co.invali d>
^^^^^^^^

[2004-04-24 17:47:26] pointedears:/var
$ chkmadd -v M.Winter@blueyo nder.co.invalid
chkmadd 0.1.2.200404220 6 -- (C) 2003, 2004 Thomas Lahn <mehl@PointedEa rs.de>
Distributed under the terms of the GNU General Public License (GPL).
See COPYING file or <http://www.fsf.org/copyleft/gpl.html> for details.
Report bugs to <chkmadd@Pointe dEars.de>.

E-mail address(es) to check:
M.Winter@blueyo nder.co.invalid

Verifying <M.Winter@bluey onder.co.invali d> ...
Mail exchanger(s) for blueyonder.co.i nvalid:
None.
Mail exchanger(s) for co.invalid:
None, thus <M.Winter@bluey onder.co.invali d>
is definitely not an e-mail address (no MX).

---------------------
Network Working Group D. Eastlake
Request for Comments: 2606 A. Panitz
BCP: 32 June 1999
Category: Best Current Practice

Reserved Top Level DNS Names

[...]

Abstract

To reduce the likelihood of conflict and confusion, a few top level
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
domain names are reserved for use in private testing, as examples in
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^
documentation, and the like. In addition, a few second level domain
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^
names reserved for use as examples are documented.

[...]

2. TLDs for Testing, & Documentation Examples
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^
There is a need for top level domain (TLD) names that can be used for
creating names which, without fear of conflicts with current or
future actual TLD names in the global DNS, can be used for private
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^
testing of existing DNS related code, examples in documentation, DNS
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^
related experimentation , invalid DNS names, or other similar uses.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^

For example, without guidance, a site might set up some local
additional unused top level domains for testing of its local DNS code
and configuration. Later, these TLDs might come into actual use on
the global Internet. As a result, local attempts to reference the
real data in these zones could be thwarted by the local test
versions. Or test or example code might be written that accesses a
TLD that is in use with the thought that the test code would only be
run in a restricted testbed net or the example never actually run.
Later, the test code could escape from the testbed or the example be
actually coded and run on the Internet. Depending on the nature of
the test or example, it might be best for it to be referencing a TLD
permanently reserved for such purposes.

To safely satisfy these needs, four domain names are reserved as
listed and described below.

.test
.example
.invalid
.localhost

[...]

".invalid" is intended for use in online construction of domain
names that are sure to be invalid and which it is obvious at a
glance are invalid.

[...]

---------------------
Network Working Group P. Resnick, Editor
Request for Comments: 2822 QUALCOMM Incorporated
Obsoletes: 822 April 2001
Category: Standards Track

Internet Message Format

[...]

3.6.2. Originator fields

The originator fields of a message consist of the from field, the
sender field (when applicable), and optionally the reply-to field.
The from field consists of the field name "From" and a
comma-separated list of one or more mailbox specifications. If the
from field contains more than one mailbox specification in the
mailbox-list, then the sender field, containing the field name
"Sender" and a single mailbox specification, MUST appear in the
message. In either case, an optional reply-to field MAY also be
included, which contains the field name "Reply-To" and a
comma-separated list of one or more addresses.

from = "From:" mailbox-list CRLF

[...]


3.4. Address Specification

Addresses occur in several message header fields to indicate senders
and recipients of messages. An address may either be an individual
mailbox, or a group of mailboxes.

[...]

mailbox = name-addr / addr-spec

name-addr = [display-name] angle-addr

name-addr = [display-name] angle-addr

angle-addr = [CFWS] "<" addr-spec ">" [CFWS] / obs-angle-addr

[...]

A mailbox receives mail. [...]
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^
---------------------

A good informal explanation why such address munging is a Bad Thing[1]:

<http://www.interhack.n et/pubs/munging-harmful/>


HTH & HAND

PointedEars
___________
[1] http://catb.org/~esr/jargon/html/B/Bad-Thing.html

[Dr John Stockton]

Re: setTimeout not executing form submit

JRS: In article <408A9BEA.40409 @PointedEars.de >, seen in
news:comp.lang. javascript, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn
<PointedEars@we b.de> posted at Sat, 24 Apr 2004 18:55:06 :[color=blue]
>optimistx wrote:[color=green]
>> Dr John Stockton wrote:[color=darkred]
>>> Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@we b.de> posted:
>>>> BTW: Your From address violates Internet/NetNews standards.
>>>
>>> I doubt it. Please quote the standard to which you refer.[/color][/color][/color]

[color=blue]
>Network Working Group D. Eastlake
>Request for Comments: 2606 A. Panitz
>BCP: 32 June 1999
>Category: Best Current Practice[/color]
[color=blue]
> To reduce the likelihood of conflict and confusion, a few top level
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> domain names are reserved for use in private testing, as examples in
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^
> documentation, and the like.[/color]


Note - "and the like".

[color=blue]
> ".invalid" is intended for use in online construction of domain
> names that are sure to be invalid and which it is obvious at a
> glance are invalid.[/color]


The TLD having been declared unusable for cross-net communication, it is
entirely reasonable to use it for non-communication.

Circumstances have changed since the time when it was not felt necessary
for that document to deal with anti-spam precautions, so nothing can be
read into the omission in respect to present-day usage.

Grow up. Remember what happened to Benito - according to Niven &
Pournelle, he eventually reaped the reward of honourable behaviour.

--
© John Stockton, Surrey, UK. ?@merlyn.demon. co.uk Turnpike v4.00 IE 4 ©
<URL:http://jibbering.com/faq/> Jim Ley's FAQ for news:comp.lang. javascript
<URL:http://www.merlyn.demo n.co.uk/js-index.htm> jscr maths, dates, sources.
<URL:http://www.merlyn.demo n.co.uk/> TP/BP/Delphi/jscr/&c, FAQ items, links.

[Jim Ley]

Re: setTimeout not executing form submit

On Fri, 23 Apr 2004 22:46:48 +0200, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn
<PointedEars@we b.de> wrote:
[color=blue]
>Jim Ley wrote:
>[color=green]
>> [...] Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn [...] wrote:[color=darkred]
>>> the IE-DOM does support function references from v5.0 on, but not
>>> additional arguments to date (IE 6.0 SP-1) --[/color]
>>
>> There's no way it can since that would break compatibility with every
>> previous version of _IE_[/color]
>
>Why? Scripts for previous versions would not use the third argument.[/color]

yet, it's near impossible to do version detection of javascript...
[color=blue][color=green]
>> setTimeout is a lousy way to cause a delay in a DOM anyway.[/color]
>
>Are you proposing a sleep() method instead, blocking the UA when called?[/color]

Nope, my proposal (which you can see in the www-svg archives) would be
for a delayed dispatchEvent. Although even the current SVG 1.2
proposal I welcome as better than setTimeout, which really is lousy.

Jim.
--
comp.lang.javas cript FAQ - http://jibbering.com/faq/

[Yann-Erwan Perio]

Re: setTimeout not executing form submit

Jim Ley wrote:
[color=blue]
> yet, it's near impossible to do version detection of javascript...[/color]

Ah, but I assume that detecting JScript wouldn't be too hard, using
conditional compilation and VBArrays...or not?
[color=blue]
> Nope, my proposal (which you can see in the www-svg archives) would be
> for a delayed dispatchEvent. Although even the current SVG 1.2
> proposal I welcome as better than setTimeout, which really is lousy.[/color]

When reading your first answer I was about to exemplify good uses for
setTimeout (other than addressing browser lack of support for events),
but the more I think to that delayed dispatchEvent, the more valid it
seems to be.

I'm not familiar with SVG yet, scanning the SVG1.2 draft yielded the
SVGRunnable and SVGTimer interfaces, do you really prefer this over
setTimeout?

I mean, it's possible to implement elegant components using setTimeout,
and to me the spec is just proposing an interface to such a component,
which, though IMHO quite correct, remains easily done with javascript
and setTimeout, and seems moreover to be missing the spirit of an
events-based system.

At least setTimeout is much more fun:-), and it being easy to use means
more flexibility for the programmer - I don't see any real added value
or innovation in the SVG two interfaces.

As for the "sleep" method, I hate the idea - that'd split the execution
context, so that would deal with javascript, while the timeout only
deals with the host, much neater.


Cheers,
Yep.

[Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn]

Re: setTimeout not executing form submit

Jim Ley wrote:
[color=blue]
> Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:[color=green]
>> Jim Ley wrote:[color=darkred]
>>> [...] Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn [...] wrote:
>>>> the IE-DOM does support function references from v5.0 on, but not
>>>> additional arguments to date (IE 6.0 SP-1) --
>>>
>>> There's no way it can since that would break compatibility with every
>>> previous version of _IE_[/color]
>>
>> Why? Scripts for previous versions would not use the third argument.[/color]
>
> yet, it's near impossible to do version detection of javascript...[/color]

Since JavaScript methods do not have fixed arity I still do not see the
problem. No edition/version of ECMAScript, JavaScript and JScript is 100%
backwards compatible.
[color=blue][color=green][color=darkred]
>>> setTimeout is a lousy way to cause a delay in a DOM anyway.[/color]
>> Are you proposing a sleep() method instead, blocking the UA when called?[/color]
>
> Nope, my proposal (which you can see in the www-svg archives) would be
> for a delayed dispatchEvent. [...][/color]

ACK, a standards compliant way of setting a timeout is required.


PointedEars

[Jim Ley]

Re: setTimeout not executing form submit

On Mon, 26 Apr 2004 22:24:47 +0200, Yann-Erwan Perio
<y-e.perio@em-lyon.com> wrote:

[color=blue]
>I'm not familiar with SVG yet, scanning the SVG1.2 draft yielded the
>SVGRunnable and SVGTimer interfaces, do you really prefer this over
>setTimeout?[/color]

Possibly not over the setTimeout which takes function reference as
first parameter, and other optional parameters, however due to the
built in weight of setTimeout if it was standardised, everyone would
expect setTimeout("chi cken()",100) to work, and I think that's
horrible.

[color=blue]
>I mean, it's possible to implement elegant components using setTimeout,
>and to me the spec is just proposing an interface to such a component,
>which, though IMHO quite correct, remains easily done with javascript
>and setTimeout, and seems moreover to be missing the spirit of an
>events-based system.[/color]

Yep, Jan-Klaas Kollhof has implemented it using setTimeout, the
problem with setTimeout is that with the compilation you can't do it
in the compact profile of ECMAScript or in most other langauges, and
DOM is supposed to be language neutral.

Jim.
--
comp.lang.javas cript FAQ - http://jibbering.com/faq/