official certification

[BillCo]

Is there any widely acknowledged official international certification
you can get as an Access developer? Something well beyond the small
access componant in the MS Office cert...

I need a benchmark to shoot for!

[Ed Robichaud]

Re: official certification

MVP seems to be a recognized standard.

"BillCo" <coleman.bill@g mail.com> wrote in message
news:1137427067 .414415.170190@ g43g2000cwa.goo glegroups.com.. .[color=blue]
>
> Is there any widely acknowledged official international certification
> you can get as an Access developer? Something well beyond the small
> access componant in the MS Office cert...
>
> I need a benchmark to shoot for!
>[/color]

[Larry Linson]

Re: official certification

"BillCo" <coleman.bill@g mail.com> wrote
[color=blue]
> Is there any widely acknowledged official international
> certification you can get as an Access developer?
> Something well beyond the small
> access componant in the MS Office cert...
>
> I need a benchmark to shoot for![/color]

At one time, there was a certification for Access development that, perhaps
with some other tests, could earn you the Microsoft Certified Professional
(MCP) designation, and the Access developer cert could be an elective in the
Microsoft Certified System Developer (MCSD) certification. But that is no
longer the case... as far as I know, Microsoft's only Access certification
is, as you state, part of the Microsoft Office USer (MOUS) certification,
for end-users.

And, no, there is no other certifying authority for Microsoft software with
anywhere near the recognition of Microsoft's own certifications.

Ed Robichaud indicated the MVP award was recognized. It is not, however, a
certification for which you can study and be tested. It is a recognition
from Microsoft for contributions to the Microsoft software user community.
See http://mvp.support.microsoft.com for a description. Microsoft decides
based on their own observations of various kinds of activity, including
newsgroup participation and user group involvement, who is to be awarded --
there is no procedure for "applying" for it.

Larry Linson
Microsoft Access MVP

[BillCo]

Re: official certification

Thanks Larry, That's what I figured... Shame though. I guess they want
SQL Server to be the big MS DB gun!

[Larry Linson]

Re: official certification


"BillCo" <coleman.bill@g mail.com> wrote
[color=blue]
> Thanks Larry, That's what I figured... Shame
> though. I guess they want SQL Server to be
> the big MS DB gun![/color]

Some of us have let Microsoft know that they should consider making Access
or Office Development part of their certification program. They said they
would consider.

I don't think it has anything to do with "competitio n" between Access and
Microsoft SQL Server... they are both "database software" but they don't
compete for the same user base or application market.

Larry Linson
Microsoft Access MVP


Larry Linson
Microsoft Access MVP

[BillCo]

Re: official certification

>Some of us have let Microsoft know that they should consider making Access[color=blue]
>or Office Development part of their certification program. They said they
>would consider.[/color]

That's great - hope your recommendation didnt fall on deaf ears!

[David W. Fenton]

Re: official certification

"Larry Linson" <bouncer@localh ost.not> wrote in
news:Q8kzf.1331 9$Zo.5533@trndd c07:
[color=blue]
> "BillCo" <coleman.bill@g mail.com> wrote
>[color=green]
> > Thanks Larry, That's what I figured... Shame
> > though. I guess they want SQL Server to be
> > the big MS DB gun![/color]
>
> Some of us have let Microsoft know that they should consider
> making Access or Office Development part of their certification
> program. They said they would consider.
>
> I don't think it has anything to do with "competitio n" between
> Access and Microsoft SQL Server... they are both "database
> software" but they don't compete for the same user base or
> application market.[/color]

And the training would be completely different, with one being
database management and administration with a subsuejct in
programming TSQL, while the other would be primarily application
programming with a subsection in database management and
administration.

And the Access certification could be entirely in development, which
give it no real overlap at all with SQL Server certification.

If that really is MS's excuse, it shows that they have absolutely no
understanding of their own product lines.

Given the way they mishandle Access (especially as reflected by
everything that's happened after A97) that wouldn't surprise me at
all.

--
David W. Fenton http://www.dfenton.com/
usenet at dfenton dot com http://www.dfenton.com/DFA/

[Larry Linson]

Re: official certification

"David W. Fenton" wrote
[color=blue]
> Given the way they mishandle Access (especially
> as reflected by everything that's happened after
>A97) that wouldn't surprise me at all.[/color]

Your guess may be valid. Have you read the blogs about Access changes in
Office 12. Seems to me it is mostly aimed at "knowledge workers" (which I
understand to be semi-but-not-quite power users of Access in an enterprise
corporate environment). They seem to be convinced that is a substantial
group of users; I'm not sure I have ever personally met a single one.

My guess, regarding certification, is that there are different groups
defining "developmen t" at Microsoft and the one with higher management's ear
now defines it only as Dot Net and its languages, thus Office fell by the
wayside as far as developer certification is concerned.

Microsoft has "Developer Evangelists" in field offices; they don't do
anything but Dot Net subjects. For Office to even be mentioned, it'd have to
bef involved / integrated with a big Dot Net application. Sometimes, as in
South Central, they will have an Access or Office developer on their
(customer) Developer Guidance Council, but I assume we are there to be the
"loyal opposition".

Larry Linson
Microsoft Access MVP

[BillCo]

Re: official certification

> My guess, regarding certification, is that there are different groups[color=blue]
> defining "developmen t" at Microsoft and the one with higher management's ear
> now defines it only as Dot Net and its languages, thus Office fell by the
> wayside as far as developer certification is concerned.[/color]

That definately fits with what is on the ms website... it's almost like
a marketing blitz pushing .net and to hell with people using VB,
access, foxpro or any other ms development software. That strategy
can't be good for business. It feels like I'm being forced my ms to
adopt their next new darling child. The question is how long before
it's replaced by the next shining new TLA?

[Larry Linson]

Re: official certification

"BillCo" wrote
[color=blue]
> That definately fits with what is on the ms
> website... it's almost like a marketing blitz
> pushing .net and to hell with people using
> VB, access, foxpro or any other ms develop-
> ment software.[/color]

No, it's not "almost like", it "_is_" what you describe.
[color=blue]
> That strategy can't be good for business.
> It feels like I'm being forced by ms to adopt
> their next new darling child.[/color]

Yes, it seems that they have abandoned all business sense, but The Boys and
Girls in Redmond are 'way too smart for that, and 'way too smart to let a
bunch of conceited developers drive the company down by forcing their "this
is the only way" approach down everyone's throat.

Thus, I conclude that this must fit in with some grander strategy that isn't
completely obvious to me. It seems to have some flavor of "the Net is the
focus of everything, not the desktop, not the LAN, not the WAN".
[color=blue]
> The question is how long before it's
> replaced by the next shining new TLA?[/color]

It was approximately 10 years for "classic VB" (VB.NET is a new language
with some common roots, but not an evolutionary development from VB6).

Larry Linson
Microsoft Access MVP

[steve.minnaar]

Re: official certification

Hi Larry, I came across one of your responses to a query about switching
from Access to VB. For once I find somebody who thinks exactly as I do
on the matter. Access is the development tool of choice.

I have been a "lone wolf" programmer since 1970 and have worked in
Fortran, Pascal, Algol (Burroughs mainfames), dBase and Access. I feel
that the power of Access fully covers all the best of the other
languages and more.

I've done a number of "one-off" projects in MS Access and finally
attempted an app. for mass market. Please have a look at
www.concisedata.co.za (the website is nothing to write home about) and
download the TOPS - Standard. I would like your opinion on the quality
of the work and what type of certification, if any, I could aim for.

Thanks and best regards

Steve Minnaar


MS Access - A legend in it's own time.

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