Oracle vs Access

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  • Rosco

    Oracle vs Access

    Does anyone have a good URL or info whre Oracle and Access are
    compared to one another in performance, security, cost etc. Before
    you jump on me I know Oracle is a Cadillac compared to Access the Ford
    Fairlane. I need this info to complete a school project. Thanks.
  • Albert D. Kallal

    #2
    Re: Oracle vs Access

    "Rosco" <rosco@cox.ne t> wrote in message
    news:6fd3h0l66b cktlt796oa242jo 0ktm7tn3m@4ax.c om...
    [color=blue]
    > Does anyone have a good URL or info whre Oracle and Access are
    > compared to one another in performance, security, cost etc. Before
    > you jump on me I know Oracle is a Cadillac compared to Access the Ford
    > Fairlane. I need this info to complete a school project. Thanks.[/color]

    To be clear, you should realize that ms-access is not the actual database.
    For example, it would be silly to compare VB and Oracle.

    C++, VB, VB.net and ms-access are all development tools that let you create
    applications that CONNECT to a database system.

    In the case of ms-access, you can choose what database engine you want. That
    database engine can be:

    JET - the default file share based system

    SQL server (a free copy of the desktop editing of sql server is included
    on every office cd for use with ms-access).
    Oracle - (or any other odbc data engine).

    So, to compare VB and Oracle,

    Or

    To compare ms-access and Oracle don't make sense at all!

    You certainly might want to compare a server based database engine like
    Oracle to a file share based engine like JET to *highlight* the differences
    in how they operate. (Ie: JET is a file share, and Oracle is a client to
    server database system).

    However, the JET data engine does NOT have to be used
    with ms-access.

    So, no one would ask you to compare VB and Oracle. This same reasoning
    applies to ms-access. Ms-access is simply a integrated development tool
    (IDE) to create applications with (this is same as VB, VB.net or c++). In
    fact, the programming language in ms-access is the same as VB (VB6 to be
    exact, and in fact even shares the same code base).

    You also note that Microsoft's sql server (or the Oracle database for this
    matter) does NOT let you create forms or develop a User interface. So, these
    database server products do NOT let you create forms. So, you have to choose
    what you will use to create the UI. That UI might be VB, c++, ms-access or
    even web based interface.

    So, there is little, if anything in ms-access that you can compare to
    Oracle. You can certainly use ms-access as a client development tool to
    Oracle, and in this case the only limits in the numbers of users will be the
    limits of the Oracle database, and NOT that of ms-access.

    There are some companies that have 1000 ms-access users working at the
    same time

    ....but of course they are connecting to sql server. Once again, the
    limits of ms-access are that of the database server that you connect to (be
    it Oracle, MySql, Sybase or Microsoft's own sql server).

    I think the question needs to be clarified, or perhaps re-worded as
    ms-access is not a database, nor is it even a data engine....

    --
    Albert D. Kallal (Access MVP)
    Edmonton, Alberta Canada
    pleaseNOOSpamKa llal@msn.com




    Comment

    • XMVP

      #3
      Re: Oracle vs Access


      "Albert D. Kallal" <PleaseNOOOsPAM Mkallal@msn.com > wrote in message
      news:0okQc.1448 1$M95.1024@pd7t w1no...


      [color=blue]
      >Ms-access is simply a integrated development tool
      > (IDE) to create applications with (this is same as VB, VB.net or c++).[/color]

      [That's why the newbies are always trying to make an executable out of it!]

      [color=blue]
      > ms-access is not a database, nor is it even a data engine....[/color]

      [Wait til Microsoft hears about that!]


      Comment

      • Albert D. Kallal

        #4
        Re: Oracle vs Access

        "XMVP" <access_morons@ hotmail.com> wrote in message
        news:meOdnY4Qn-E9HI_cRVn-jg@vnet-inc.com...[color=blue]
        >
        > "Albert D. Kallal" <PleaseNOOOsPAM Mkallal@msn.com > wrote in message
        > news:0okQc.1448 1$M95.1024@pd7t w1no...
        >
        >
        >[color=green]
        > >Ms-access is simply a integrated development tool
        > > (IDE) to create applications with (this is same as VB, VB.net or c++).[/color]
        >
        > [That's why the newbies are always trying to make an executable out of[/color]
        it!]

        LOL!...this is true! I will add that with .net you do need a 20 meg runtime
        also..so, really, the concept of a runtime for use with applications
        certainly has made the big show. You make a .exe in .net...but you need
        that other 20 meg thing!!! (kind of like ms-access now.....eh?!).
        [color=blue][color=green]
        > > ms-access is not a database, nor is it even a data engine....[/color]
        >
        > [Wait til Microsoft hears about that!]
        >[/color]

        It would be most fair to point that "most" in the IT industry do refer to
        ms-access as a database . (I would accept any reasonable argument on this
        issue..since ms-access has been around for 10 years now..and the general
        term "ms-access" does hint, or imply some type of database).

        However, for the last 3 versions ms-access can function as a native client
        to sql server (no jet or local tables are even allowed!). So, I think it is
        quite fair to view ms-access as a IDE like VB or whatever, since it can be
        used in a 100% client mode with no local data engine.

        If there is no data, no tables and no data engine, then it really can't be a
        database...can it?


        --
        Albert D. Kallal (Access MVP)
        Edmonton, Alberta Canada
        pleaseNOOSpamKa llal@msn.com



        Comment

        • XMVP

          #5
          Re: Oracle vs Access


          "Albert D. Kallal" <PleaseNOOOsPAM Mkallal@msn.com > wrote in message
          news:22AQc.1893 2$M95.15728@pd7 tw1no...
          [color=blue]
          >
          > If there is no data, no tables and no data engine, then it really can't be[/color]
          a[color=blue]
          > database...can it?
          >[/color]


          I think you're splitting hairs. What you're arguing sounds like something
          out of "Computer Metaphysics 101," where a bunch of students sit around
          asking questions like WHAT IS A DATABASE? Or maybe, WHEN IS A DATABASE NOT
          A DATABASE?

          "Database" is just a general term to describe an assortment of files
          (programs, libraries, etc.) that work together to achieve a desired result.
          It makes no difference if the files are all from the same vendor and come on
          one CD or if they come from many vendors on many CDs.

          Look at it this way. If you bought a car you'd expect it to have an engine
          right? Why? Because it won't function without an engine. But it would
          still be a car. What else can you call it?

          Microsoft throws in one or two engines with every copy of Access so they can
          call Access a "database."


          According to Google, definitions of "database" on the Web:
          an organized body of related information



          A collection of data: part numbers, product codes, customer information,
          etc. It usually refers to data organized and stored on a computer that can
          be searched and retrieved by a computer program. Back to Top
          support.sbcglob al.net/general/662.shtml


          A data structure that stores metadata, i.e. data about data. More
          generally, an organized collection of information.



          A collection of information organized and presented to serve a specific
          purpose. (A telephone book is a common database.) A computerized database is
          an updated, organized file of machine readable information that is rapidly
          searched and retrieved by computer.



          An organized collection of information in computerized format.



          a computerized collection of information.
          altweb.jhsph.ed u/education/glossary.htm


          A collection of related information. All the data about a calf crop might
          be called a database. See DBMS.



          A collection of information, usually stored in an electronic format that
          can be searched by a computer.



          Any organized collection of information; it may be paper or electronic.



          - can be as simple as a card file; a collection of information stored in a
          computer medium that can be easily accessed and manipulated.



          A specific collection of information. Most sites typically have a single
          database for their full text collections, with separate databases for
          abstract databases. Download The action of saving information to your disk,
          whether permanent or temporary, for personal reference or use.
          scienceserver.c ilea.it/help/default/glossary.htm


          1. Any collection of information on a specific subject or area.
          Specifically, a computerized collection of such information. 2. A computer
          program designed to store such information.



          a database is an organized collection of information or data. The Swansea
          Voyager catalogue is a database of library stock and we have access to other
          databases, such as Web of Science, which can help you to find information on
          a topic. Our subject services page can help you to select a database.



          (MySQL)-A collection of organized information in which a computer can
          easily display and select different fields of data. You can think of a
          database as an electronic filing system. You can include anything from
          birthdays to travel itinerary in a database. MySQL is the database
          management system we feature at Thelix. Back to Top



          A collection of related information about a subject organized in a useful
          manner that provides a base or foundation for procedures such as retrieving
          information, drawing conclusions, and making decisions.



          A shared collection of logically related data, designed to meet the
          information needs of multiple users in an organization. The term database is
          often erroneously referred to as a synonym for a "database management system
          (DBMS)". They are not equivalent. A database is a store of data that
          describe entities and the relationships between the entities. A database
          management system is the software mechanism for managing that data.



          A collection of data or information. As the term is usually employed in
          on-line information retrieval, it refers to a collection of records.




          A set of related information created, stored, or manipulated by a
          computerized management information system.



          Related information stored in one location in a digital format. Dependant
          upon the software used to manage a database, minimally, information can be
          added to, retrieved from and sorted.
          RTP Live hari ini pragmatic play sudah ada di link info bocoran rtp slot gacor malam ini terlengkap menyediakan seluruh jenis rtp tertinggi untuk di analisa pemain slot online.



          A database is a collection of data, typically organized to make common
          retrievals easy and efficient. Some common database programs include Oracle,
          Sybase, Postgres, Informix, Filemaker, etc.



          A collection of related types of data in a single file or set of files for
          sorting, analysing, and reporting.
          knight.city.ba. k12.md.us/ib/glossary.htm


          One or more structured sets of persistent data, usually associated with
          software (a database management system) to update and query the data. In
          AIPS++, the Table system is used to enable a database. A simple database
          might be a single file containing many records, each of which contains the
          same set of fields where each field is a certain fixed width. A more complex
          relational database allows the definition of data structures, storage and
          retrieval operations, and integrity constraints. In such a database, the
          data and relations between them are organized in tables.
          aips2.nrao.edu/docs/glossary/d.html


          D Database - an organized collection of information (e.g. ERIC, The
          Catalogue).
          library.usask.c a/tutorials/basics/tutorial/gloss.html


          a collection of information in electronic format. Some databases have
          bibliographical information relating to books, articles, and other published
          material. Other databases provide numeric or statistical information. [Find
          out more about the databases available from Memorial at MUN Libraries:
          Databases.]



          is an organized collection of information stored on a computer. With
          Optix, a database is an organized collection of electronic documents stored
          on a computer. The database is structured to facilitate the search and
          retrieval of information contained in the database.



          A collection of stored data.







          Comment

          • Albert D. Kallal

            #6
            Re: Oracle vs Access

            "XMVP" <access_morons@ hotmail.com> wrote in message
            news:s-WdnQ8QPPM_l47cR Vn-og@vnet-inc.com...
            [color=blue]
            > I think you're splitting hairs. What you're arguing sounds like something
            > out of "Computer Metaphysics 101," where a bunch of students sit around
            > asking questions like WHAT IS A DATABASE? Or maybe, WHEN IS A DATABASE[/color]
            NOT[color=blue]
            > A DATABASE?
            >
            > "Database" is just a general term to describe an assortment of files
            > (programs, libraries, etc.) that work together to achieve a desired[/color]
            result.[color=blue]
            > It makes no difference if the files are all from the same vendor and come[/color]
            on[color=blue]
            > one CD or if they come from many vendors on many CDs.
            >
            > Look at it this way. If you bought a car you'd expect it to have an[/color]
            engine[color=blue]
            > right? Why? Because it won't function without an engine. But it would
            > still be a car. What else can you call it?
            >
            > Microsoft throws in one or two engines with every copy of Access so they[/color]
            can[color=blue]
            > call Access a "database."[/color]

            Actually, this issue is more then just splitting hairs, or one of semantics
            here.

            I mean, it is rather silly to compare ms-access to Oracle?

            Sure, lets compare JET to Oracle, or the MSDE to Oracle , or sql server to
            oracle.

            If you speak of ms-access as product, then it has data engines, and also has
            a IDE. In fact, we are talking about a data client development tool.

            We certainly could and should compare ms-access to the Oracle client tools
            (The Oracle forms developer suite).

            So, yes, we can call ms-access a database by many definitions as you show (I
            am not disagreeing on that). In fact, based on the many links for data defs
            you have, then we can call VB, or c++ a database by those defs (if you
            include the JET dao library with those products, and, this is often
            done...especial ly with VB)

            However, for the sake learning something, ms-access is more of client
            development tool then it is a database. So, sure, lets compare the Oracle
            Forms Developer Suite to ms-access.

            However, I am at a loss as to how (or why) we would compare VB to Oracle, or
            compare c++ to Oracle, or ms-access to Oracle????

            Unless some clarification of the database engine is made, the term
            "ms-access" is much too loose to define what is to be compared to Oracle.

            So, yea...we can say they both are cars...but lets not compare the seats in
            one car to the engine in the other car...it don't make sense to do that.

            Lets not compare the tires on one car to the engine on the other car....

            To learn and have a discussion on, this matter...we will need to define what
            is to be compared. So, sure, lets compare ms-access forms against the Forms
            tools in Oracle....I have no probelm with that...

            --
            Albert D. Kallal (Access MVP)
            Edmonton, Alberta Canada
            pleaseNOOSpamKa llal@msn.com



            Comment

            • XMVP

              #7
              Re: Oracle vs Access


              "Albert D. Kallal" <PleaseNOOOsPAM Mkallal@msn.com > wrote in message
              news:YMHQc.2677 3$M95.21859@pd7 tw1no...[color=blue]
              > "XMVP" <access_morons@ hotmail.com> wrote in message
              > news:s-WdnQ8QPPM_l47cR Vn-og@vnet-inc.com...
              >[color=green]
              > > I think you're splitting hairs. What you're arguing sounds like[/color][/color]
              something[color=blue][color=green]
              > > out of "Computer Metaphysics 101," where a bunch of students sit around
              > > asking questions like WHAT IS A DATABASE? Or maybe, WHEN IS A DATABASE[/color]
              > NOT[color=green]
              > > A DATABASE?
              > >
              > > "Database" is just a general term to describe an assortment of files
              > > (programs, libraries, etc.) that work together to achieve a desired[/color]
              > result.[color=green]
              > > It makes no difference if the files are all from the same vendor and[/color][/color]
              come[color=blue]
              > on[color=green]
              > > one CD or if they come from many vendors on many CDs.
              > >
              > > Look at it this way. If you bought a car you'd expect it to have an[/color]
              > engine[color=green]
              > > right? Why? Because it won't function without an engine. But it would
              > > still be a car. What else can you call it?
              > >
              > > Microsoft throws in one or two engines with every copy of Access so they[/color]
              > can[color=green]
              > > call Access a "database."[/color]
              >
              > Actually, this issue is more then just splitting hairs, or one of[/color]
              semantics[color=blue]
              > here.
              >
              > I mean, it is rather silly to compare ms-access to Oracle?
              >
              > Sure, lets compare JET to Oracle, or the MSDE to Oracle , or sql server to
              > oracle.
              >
              > If you speak of ms-access as product, then it has data engines, and also[/color]
              has[color=blue]
              > a IDE. In fact, we are talking about a data client development tool.
              >
              > We certainly could and should compare ms-access to the Oracle client tools
              > (The Oracle forms developer suite).
              >
              > So, yes, we can call ms-access a database by many definitions as you show[/color]
              (I[color=blue]
              > am not disagreeing on that). In fact, based on the many links for data[/color]
              defs[color=blue]
              > you have, then we can call VB, or c++ a database by those defs (if you
              > include the JET dao library with those products, and, this is often
              > done...especial ly with VB)
              >
              > However, for the sake learning something, ms-access is more of client
              > development tool then it is a database. So, sure, lets compare the Oracle
              > Forms Developer Suite to ms-access.
              >
              > However, I am at a loss as to how (or why) we would compare VB to Oracle,[/color]
              or[color=blue]
              > compare c++ to Oracle, or ms-access to Oracle????
              >
              > Unless some clarification of the database engine is made, the term
              > "ms-access" is much too loose to define what is to be compared to Oracle.
              >
              > So, yea...we can say they both are cars...but lets not compare the seats[/color]
              in[color=blue]
              > one car to the engine in the other car...it don't make sense to do that.
              >
              > Lets not compare the tires on one car to the engine on the other car....
              >
              > To learn and have a discussion on, this matter...we will need to define[/color]
              what[color=blue]
              > is to be compared. So, sure, lets compare ms-access forms against the[/color]
              Forms[color=blue]
              > tools in Oracle....I have no probelm with that...
              >
              > --
              > Albert D. Kallal (Access MVP)
              > Edmonton, Alberta Canada
              > pleaseNOOSpamKa llal@msn.com
              > http://www.attcanada.net/~kallal.msn
              >
              >[/color]

              All you're saying is that some software products have more of the "parts"
              needed to build a database and other software products don't have enough.
              If we're talking about a "total solution" database product, meaning a bundle
              of files that when used in various combinations produces a finished product
              everybody recognizes as a "database," or maybe more accurately as a
              "database application," then Access beats all the other products you
              mentioned. It has form objects to input data, table objects to store data,
              report objects to output data, and various other objects to manipulate,
              relate, and maintain data. (Okay so it has no security!)

              The original poster IMPLIED that Access and Oracle were interchangeable
              products--that either could be used to build a total database solution,
              which of course is not true, as you pointed out. I don't take exception to
              that. The implied comparison is obviously faulty.

              But I do take exception to the idea that Access should be "deconstruc ted"
              and its parts compared to the parts of other database products, which is
              what you seem to be saying. Under your analysis, Access is essentially a
              product for developing front ends, i.e., the user objects. That's wrong.
              It's a product for developing total database solutions, no matter if those
              solutions come with a crappy little four-cylinder engine. Oracle or SQL
              Server, to the contrary, are not total database solutions, although they
              have monster engines, to extend the metaphor.

              So if we want to compare parts, then Access will win some comparisons and
              Oracle or SQL Server will win other comparisons. But if we're talking about
              a total database solution as the definition of a "database," then Oracle or
              SQL Server are not even in the running.

              I understand what you're getting at, that Access is seen by most
              professional database developers (and by Microsoft to some extent) as merely
              an IDE for making front ends for use with some other back end, what you call
              a "client development tool." But that assertion, while fairly accurate, is
              also somewhat misleading because client development tools generally produce
              standalone programs (executables).

              Off topic, I will also say this. Access has become the bastard child of
              Microsoft. The company would disown it if it could because there's almost
              no market for a "desktop database" these days, which is what Access was
              originally designed to be. Now, nearly everybody has at least a little LAN
              running and a server someplace that could easily accommodate a 5- or 10-
              client license SQL Server setup. Access needs to be folded into SQL Server
              and disappear from the face of the earth.



              Comment

              • Lyle Fairfield

                #8
                Re: Oracle vs Access

                "XMVP" <access_morons@ hotmail.com> wrote in
                news:Zcadnf9vtI JlLI7cRVn-jg@vnet-inc.com:
                [color=blue]
                > All you're saying is that some software products have more of the
                > "parts" needed to build a database and other software products don't
                > have enough. If we're talking about a "total solution" database product,
                > meaning a bundle of files that when used in various combinations
                > produces a finished product everybody recognizes as a "database," or
                > maybe more accurately as a "database application," then Access beats all
                > the other products you mentioned. It has form objects to input data,
                > table objects to store data, report objects to output data, and various
                > other objects to manipulate, relate, and maintain data. (Okay so it has
                > no security!)
                >
                > The original poster IMPLIED that Access and Oracle were interchangeable
                > products--that either could be used to build a total database solution,
                > which of course is not true, as you pointed out. I don't take exception
                > to that. The implied comparison is obviously faulty.
                >
                > But I do take exception to the idea that Access should be
                > "deconstruc ted" and its parts compared to the parts of other database
                > products, which is what you seem to be saying. Under your analysis,
                > Access is essentially a product for developing front ends, i.e., the
                > user objects. That's wrong. It's a product for developing total
                > database solutions, no matter if those solutions come with a crappy
                > little four-cylinder engine. Oracle or SQL Server, to the contrary, are
                > not total database solutions, although they have monster engines, to
                > extend the metaphor.
                >
                > So if we want to compare parts, then Access will win some comparisons
                > and Oracle or SQL Server will win other comparisons. But if we're
                > talking about a total database solution as the definition of a
                > "database," then Oracle or SQL Server are not even in the running.
                >
                > I understand what you're getting at, that Access is seen by most
                > professional database developers (and by Microsoft to some extent) as
                > merely an IDE for making front ends for use with some other back end,
                > what you call a "client development tool." But that assertion, while
                > fairly accurate, is also somewhat misleading because client development
                > tools generally produce standalone programs (executables).
                >
                > Off topic, I will also say this. Access has become the bastard child of
                > Microsoft. The company would disown it if it could because there's
                > almost no market for a "desktop database" these days, which is what
                > Access was originally designed to be. Now, nearly everybody has at
                > least a little LAN running and a server someplace that could easily
                > accommodate a 5- or 10- client license SQL Server setup. Access needs
                > to be folded into SQL Server and disappear from the face of the earth.[/color]

                There are some interesting points here; the portraying and championing of
                Access as Gestalt hadn't occurred to me previously.

                More like this, please, Don.


                --
                Lyle
                --
                use iso date format: yyyy-mm-dd

                --
                The e-mail address isn't, but you could use it to find one.

                Comment

                • Steve

                  #9
                  Re: Oracle vs Access

                  On Fri, 6 Aug 2004 10:29:40 -0600, "XMVP" <access_morons@ hotmail.com>
                  wrote:


                  <snip>[color=blue]
                  >
                  >Off topic, I will also say this. Access has become the bastard child of
                  >Microsoft. The company would disown it if it could because there's almost
                  >no market for a "desktop database" these days, which is what Access was
                  >originally designed to be. Now, nearly everybody has at least a little LAN
                  >running and a server someplace that could easily accommodate a 5- or 10-
                  >client license SQL Server setup. Access needs to be folded into SQL Server
                  >and disappear from the face of the earth.[/color]

                  There are still numerous systems that are better served with a
                  "desktop database" then requiring a SQL Server.

                  Steven



                  [color=blue]
                  >[/color]

                  Comment

                  • XMVP

                    #10
                    Re: Oracle vs Access


                    "Steve" <steve@nospam.c om> wrote in message
                    news:4113c381.1 46447310@news.w estnet.com...[color=blue]
                    > On Fri, 6 Aug 2004 10:29:40 -0600, "XMVP" <access_morons@ hotmail.com>
                    >[/color]
                    [color=blue]
                    > There are still numerous systems that are better served with a
                    > "desktop database" then requiring a SQL Server.
                    >[/color]

                    I can't think of any such systems, unless you're talking about a one-desktop
                    "system" with no future. But that's hypocritical of me to say that because
                    I actually own two "systems" that are only one computer each, neither of
                    which has any future, except moving to the garage. Yes, I have two desktop
                    machines both running SQL Server 2000. (I also have a full-blown
                    client-server system to emulate my customers' systems.) But it's still a
                    little devious of me to suggest SQL Server for all situations whatsoever
                    because I've never shelled out a dime for SQL Server! Okay. Maybe I've
                    paid for it indirectly in the price of developer editions, but the cost is
                    really insignificant compared to the what the commercial version costs.

                    If we're NOT talking about Joey's baseball card collection, or Millie's
                    basement basket-weaving business, then we're talking about several machines
                    and a for-profit business. We're also talking about a small business that
                    will likely grow, i.e, the business will be adding machines (users) to the
                    system at fairly consistent rate.

                    In the REAL WORLD, which is a place where people actually have to pay for
                    Microsoft software and have to pay somebody to maintain it, SQL Server seems
                    like an expensive proposition at first. But as time goes by, and new
                    machines and even new locations are added to the system, the cost is easily
                    recovered. And all the while SQL Server never complains. It's the server
                    that keeps on serving!

                    [And please, no stories about Jet, the little engine that could.]


                    Comment

                    • Larry  Linson

                      #11
                      Re: Oracle vs Access

                      What the Heck, Donnie. Are you trying to enter into some
                      apparently-serious-about-databases-on-topic discussion to try to
                      rehabilitate yourself and your image?

                      If you want to rehabilitate yourself in this newsgroup, skip the
                      philosophical babble, stop your trolling, retire your sockpuppets, and go
                      answer some real questions (under your name instead of your "handle").

                      Larry Linson




                      Comment

                      • Steve

                        #12
                        Re: Oracle vs Access

                        On Fri, 6 Aug 2004 14:03:39 -0600, "XMVP" <access_morons@ hotmail.com>
                        wrote:
                        [color=blue]
                        >
                        >"Steve" <steve@nospam.c om> wrote in message
                        >news:4113c381. 146447310@news. westnet.com...[color=green]
                        >> On Fri, 6 Aug 2004 10:29:40 -0600, "XMVP" <access_morons@ hotmail.com>
                        >>[/color]
                        >[color=green]
                        >> There are still numerous systems that are better served with a
                        >> "desktop database" then requiring a SQL Server.
                        >>[/color]
                        >
                        >I can't think of any such systems, unless you're talking about a one-desktop
                        >"system" with no future.[/color]

                        Just because you can't think of it, does not mean it does not exist.
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                        >But that's hypocritical of me to say that because
                        >I actually own two "systems" that are only one computer each, neither of
                        >which has any future, except moving to the garage. Yes, I have two desktop
                        >machines both running SQL Server 2000. (I also have a full-blown
                        >client-server system to emulate my customers' systems.) But it's still a
                        >little devious of me to suggest SQL Server for all situations whatsoever
                        >because I've never shelled out a dime for SQL Server! Okay. Maybe I've
                        >paid for it indirectly in the price of developer editions, but the cost is
                        >really insignificant compared to the what the commercial version costs.
                        >[/color]

                        I really don't see what your limited hardware situation has to do with
                        the future life of desktop databases.
                        [color=blue]
                        >If we're NOT talking about Joey's baseball card collection, or Millie's
                        >basement basket-weaving business, then we're talking about several machines
                        >and a for-profit business. We're also talking about a small business that
                        >will likely grow, i.e, the business will be adding machines (users) to the
                        >system at fairly consistent rate.[/color]

                        I am not talking about your clients either. However, speaking about
                        small businesses, products like QuickBooks are perfect examples of
                        productive tools using "desktop" databases.

                        Of course, you also have information being distributed in databases
                        which is best sent in a common database format (e.g. MDB or DBF). I
                        really don't want to set-up a SQL Server to access such information,
                        even though I have several servers in my office which are more than
                        capable of handling the task.

                        And then you have applications where the user wants to jump between
                        different, distinct databases (e.g. like QuickBooks), and quickly copy
                        one of the databases to a laptop, etc ... We are currently working on
                        such an application now.
                        [color=blue]
                        >
                        >In the REAL WORLD, which is a place where people actually have to pay for
                        >Microsoft software and have to pay somebody to maintain it, SQL Server seems
                        >like an expensive proposition at first.[/color]

                        SQL Server is not expensive. Price is not the issue.

                        [color=blue]
                        > But as time goes by, and new
                        >machines and even new locations are added to the system, the cost is easily
                        >recovered. And all the while SQL Server never complains. It's the server
                        >that keeps on serving![/color]


                        You focusing on certain types of applications only, for which I agree
                        with you regarding SQL Server. But not all databases require
                        multi-user, secured, client-server access; and some even are hindered
                        by such.

                        Ironically,my server tape backup system uses SQL Server to store the
                        detail results of its backup. So, it loaded SQL Server on my main
                        file server for this trival tasks. Stupid.
                        [color=blue]
                        >
                        >[And please, no stories about Jet, the little engine that could.][/color]

                        Jet is a brilliant desktop engine that serves many purposes. Just
                        because some have pushed it too far, or do not understand its
                        limitations, does not make it a poor engine.

                        Of course, this discussion will become mute as the next version of
                        Windows includes SQL Server.

                        Steven


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