IBM X336 server with RAID1 configuration formats all HDDs on newhardware installation

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  • Sid B
    #1

    IBM X336 server with RAID1 configuration formats all HDDs on newhardware installation

    (apologies for the cross-post)

    Hi,

    I am new to my company and have been asked to recommend a new
    redundancy / backup plan for our online server. I've talked to the
    other folks in the company and they have been describing an usual
    feature of the server wherein if we try to install ANY new hardware
    like a new harddisk, the system automatically formats everything.
    (apparently this "resetting feature" kicks in even if we add more RAM
    pieces!)

    Now, I'm not too sure what portions of this are correct and what are
    not. As this is our LIVE online server and we are serving hundreds of
    thousands of documents on it at any point, therefore I am hesistant to
    "try anything" before fully understanding all aspects.

    The specifications are as follows:
    CPU: Intel(r) Xeon (tm) cpu 3ghz (Dual processor)
    Speed: 3 GHz
    RAM: 4 GB
    HDD: 2 x 140 GB (on RAID1)
    Type: ADAPTEC RAID 1 SCSI Disk Drive
    Server contains: Online Application and Database (SQL Server 2005)
    Partitions: C: 30 GB, E: 110 GB
    SCSI controller: (not known at this point)


    The problems we're facing are as follows:
    (a) Because of the low partition in C drive, we regularly have to run
    maintenance tasks on the server which if we dont leads to our site
    being inaccessible to our users.
    (b) Our database is stored on E drive (about 60 GB of data). There is
    a performance issue which our users face, but we are unsure of what we
    should do to solve the problem.

    I'm looking to understand:
    (1) the automatic hard-disk formatting issue and how to solve it
    (2) how we can upgrade our hardware in the most optimum fashion

    Thanks!
    Sid :)
    Tags: None
    • nik Simpson
      #2
      Re: IBM X336 server with RAID1 configuration formats all HDDs onnew hardware installation

      Sid B wrote:
      (apologies for the cross-post)
      >
      You'd be better off asking on comp.arch.stora ge, or better yet IBM
      support, because it definitely shouldn't be doing this.


      --
      Nik Simpson

        Comment

        • Del Cecchi
          #3
          Re: IBM X336 server with RAID1 configuration formats all HDDs on new hardware installation


          "nik Simpson" <nik_s@knology. netwrote in message
          news:a9a6c$4913 b176$4b4ca99b$2 0504@KNOLOGY.NE T...
          Sid B wrote:
          >(apologies for the cross-post)
          >>
          >
          You'd be better off asking on comp.arch.stora ge, or better yet IBM
          support, because it definitely shouldn't be doing this.
          >
          >
          --
          Nik Simpson
          Since he is apparently running MS software, shouldn't he ask them? Or
          is that support provided through IBM?


            Comment

            • nik Simpson
              #4
              Re: IBM X336 server with RAID1 configuration formats all HDDs onnew hardware installation

              Del Cecchi wrote:
              "nik Simpson" <nik_s@knology. netwrote in message
              news:a9a6c$4913 b176$4b4ca99b$2 0504@KNOLOGY.NE T...
              >Sid B wrote:
              >>(apologies for the cross-post)
              >>>
              >You'd be better off asking on comp.arch.stora ge, or better yet IBM
              >support, because it definitely shouldn't be doing this.
              >
              Since he is apparently running MS software, shouldn't he ask them? Or
              is that support provided through IBM?
              >
              >
              Can't be the OS, since when the reformatting takes place, the OS isn't
              even loaded, seems more like a misconfigured RAID BIOS or hardware
              problem, so I'd start with IBM support.

              --
              Nik Simpson

                Comment

                • Erland Sommarskog
                  #5
                  Re: IBM X336 server with RAID1 configuration formats all HDDs on new hardware installation

                  Sid B (siliconpi@gmai l.com) writes:
                  I am new to my company and have been asked to recommend a new
                  redundancy / backup plan for our online server. I've talked to the
                  other folks in the company and they have been describing an usual
                  feature of the server wherein if we try to install ANY new hardware
                  like a new harddisk, the system automatically formats everything.
                  (apparently this "resetting feature" kicks in even if we add more RAM
                  pieces!)
                  That sounds scary! Well, my expertise is SQL Server, so I cannot comment
                  on that part.
                  The specifications are as follows:
                  CPU: Intel(r) Xeon (tm) cpu 3ghz (Dual processor)
                  Speed: 3 GHz
                  RAM: 4 GB
                  HDD: 2 x 140 GB (on RAID1)
                  Type: ADAPTEC RAID 1 SCSI Disk Drive
                  Server contains: Online Application and Database (SQL Server 2005)
                  Partitions: C: 30 GB, E: 110 GB
                  SCSI controller: (not known at this point)
                  >
                  >
                  The problems we're facing are as follows:
                  (a) Because of the low partition in C drive, we regularly have to run
                  maintenance tasks on the server which if we dont leads to our site
                  being inaccessible to our users.
                  (b) Our database is stored on E drive (about 60 GB of data). There is
                  a performance issue which our users face, but we are unsure of what we
                  should do to solve the problem.
                  The hardware configuration is not that impressive, but that does not
                  mean that it's insufficient. Your problem could just as well be a few
                  misbehaving queries, and fixing those, or just adding some indexes
                  could make your users very happy.

                  There are several ways to examine this. One way is to speak with users
                  to see if there are any specific operations that are slow. Another is
                  to ser up a trace that captures statements that runs for, say, more
                  than 100 ms, and the analyse that data.

                  There is a point when buying more hardware is cheaping than tuning,
                  particularly if tuning means lots of code to rewrite. But there is
                  also the other end when better hardware to some extent masks as
                  poorly implemented application, which you can get a lot better performance
                  from with small efforts.



                  --
                  Erland Sommarskog, SQL Server MVP, esquel@sommarsk og.se

                  Links for SQL Server Books Online:
                  SQL 2008: http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/sqlserver/cc514207.aspx
                  SQL 2005: http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/sqlserver/bb895970.aspx
                  SQL 2000: http://www.microsoft.com/sql/prodinf...ons/books.mspx

                    Comment

                    • Terje Mathisen
                      #6
                      Re: IBM X336 server with RAID1 configuration formats all HDDs onnew hardware installation

                      Erland Sommarskog wrote:
                      Sid B (siliconpi@gmai l.com) writes:
                      >I am new to my company and have been asked to recommend a new
                      >redundancy / backup plan for our online server. I've talked to the
                      >other folks in the company and they have been describing an usual
                      >feature of the server wherein if we try to install ANY new hardware
                      >like a new harddisk, the system automatically formats everything.
                      >(apparently this "resetting feature" kicks in even if we add more RAM
                      >pieces!)
                      >
                      That sounds scary! Well, my expertise is SQL Server, so I cannot comment
                      on that part.
                      [snip]
                      There is a point when buying more hardware is cheaping than tuning,
                      particularly if tuning means lots of code to rewrite.
                      In this particular case the "feature" is a horrible bug, and you should
                      run (not walk! :-) to your nearest dealer of reasonable hardware and get
                      a new server immediately.

                      You then setup this new server appropriately, copy your application over
                      and replace the broken one.

                      The reason I'm calling it broken is simply this:

                      With such a mis-feature, any kind of hardware error, like a RAM dimm
                      going bad and being mapped out, would cause the server to immediately
                      erase everything as soon as it had finished rebooting.
                      :-(

                      Terje
                      --
                      - <Terje.Mathisen @hda.hydro.com>
                      "almost all programming can be viewed as an exercise in caching"

                        Comment

                        • Del Cecchi
                          #7
                          Re: IBM X336 server with RAID1 configuration formats all HDDs on new hardware installation


                          "Terje Mathisen" <terje.mathisen @hda.hydro.comw rote in message
                          news:Qv2dnV4xv8 zPHIjUnZ2dnUVZ_ uGdnZ2d@giganew s.com...
                          Erland Sommarskog wrote:
                          >Sid B (siliconpi@gmai l.com) writes:
                          >>I am new to my company and have been asked to recommend a new
                          >>redundancy / backup plan for our online server. I've talked to the
                          >>other folks in the company and they have been describing an usual
                          >>feature of the server wherein if we try to install ANY new
                          >>hardware
                          >>like a new harddisk, the system automatically formats everything.
                          >>(apparently this "resetting feature" kicks in even if we add more
                          >>RAM
                          >>pieces!)
                          >>
                          >That sounds scary! Well, my expertise is SQL Server, so I cannot
                          >comment
                          >on that part.
                          [snip]
                          >There is a point when buying more hardware is cheaping than tuning,
                          >particularly if tuning means lots of code to rewrite.
                          >
                          In this particular case the "feature" is a horrible bug, and you
                          should run (not walk! :-) to your nearest dealer of reasonable
                          hardware and get a new server immediately.
                          >
                          You then setup this new server appropriately, copy your application
                          over and replace the broken one.
                          >
                          The reason I'm calling it broken is simply this:
                          >
                          With such a mis-feature, any kind of hardware error, like a RAM dimm
                          going bad and being mapped out, would cause the server to
                          immediately erase everything as soon as it had finished rebooting.
                          :-(
                          >
                          Terje
                          --
                          - <Terje.Mathisen @hda.hydro.com>
                          "almost all programming can be viewed as an exercise in caching"
                          If it's a bug it wasn't there when it left the factory. Sounds like
                          some maroon screwed it up.


                            Comment

                            • Glen Herrmannsfeldt
                              #8
                              Re: IBM X336 server with RAID1 configuration formats all HDDs onnew hardware installation

                              Terje Mathisen wrote:
                              (snip)
                              With such a mis-feature, any kind of hardware error, like a RAM dimm
                              going bad and being mapped out, would cause the server to immediately
                              erase everything as soon as it had finished rebooting.
                              I can see that as useful in some cryptographic applications.

                              -- glen

                                Comment

                                • Terje Mathisen
                                  #9
                                  Re: IBM X336 server with RAID1 configuration formats all HDDs onnew hardware installation

                                  Glen Herrmannsfeldt wrote:
                                  Terje Mathisen wrote:
                                  (snip)
                                  >
                                  >With such a mis-feature, any kind of hardware error, like a RAM dimm
                                  >going bad and being mapped out, would cause the server to immediately
                                  >erase everything as soon as it had finished rebooting.
                                  >
                                  I can see that as useful in some cryptographic applications.
                                  As in macro-level quantum crypto?

                                  If you try to inspect it, the bit(s) disappear!

                                  Terje

                                  --
                                  - <Terje.Mathisen @hda.hydro.com>
                                  "almost all programming can be viewed as an exercise in caching"

                                    Comment

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