PHP vs. J2EE

**Rik** · Jul 31 '06, 03:35 PM

Re: PHP vs. J2EE

Luca wrote:

I am not a programmer but I do work in the ICT sector.
>
I read somewhere that J2EE would be "dying" and that PHP would be
taking its place soon...
Is this complete crap or does it have some real base ?

It's crap, plain and simple, PHP cannot take it's place.

PHP can be preferred for some usages Jave is currently used for, but far
from all of it.

Grtz,
--
Rik Wasmus

**Erwin Moller** · Jul 31 '06, 03:35 PM

Re: PHP vs. J2EE

Luca wrote:

I am not a programmer but I do work in the ICT sector.
>
I read somewhere that J2EE would be "dying" and that PHP would be
taking its place soon...
Is this complete crap or does it have some real base ?

Hi Luca,

Difficult question.
I did J2EE for a few years but quited with it about 3-4 years ago.
In favor of PHP.

But J2EE and PHP are really 2 different beasts.
In very general words: J2EE is a lot more complex (from an users point of
view) and a lot harder to master than PHP.

Once you get confortable with PHP you can develop very fast: all functions
are build in PHP, and extending the language is relative easy (PEAR/PECL).

What I didn't like in J2EE was the fact I needed to browse through many
pages documentation all the time to get the job done. The number of classes
you need to master is huge.

Pro-J2EE: Once you know the basics (take a half year study/practice time
off), you just can do more than with PHP.
For example: It is easy to let JSP-pages communicate with each other. In PHP
you'll need sessions or database, while J2EE can share (references to)
objects that are in-process/memory.

I do miss a few possibilities I had in J2EE in PHP, but in general I am
happy I made the switch. PHP is language (for me) that I can fold the way I
think. That is something every proprammer likes. In Java I often had the
feeling I needed to do a lot of hard difficult work to get simple things
done.

To put it otherwise: Java/J2EE has a very steep learningcurve, where
everybody can get started with PHP, and get things done fast.

I don't know if J2EE will die, last year a few headhunters tried to get me
back into J2EE (which I refused, alltough it pays well).
That means that (at least in Europe) not enough people have J2EE skills
these days.

If someone asks me which language they should learn, I always advise PHP
because it is so easy to start with that most people will get motivated
fast, which is important. If you start with programming, and you start with
Java, chances are bigger that you'll quit with a frustrated feeling.

just my 2 cent.

Regards,
Erwin Moller

>
Regards

**Vincent Delporte** · Jul 31 '06, 04:45 PM

Re: PHP vs. J2EE

On Mon, 31 Jul 2006 17:43:13 +0200, Erwin Moller
<since_humans_r ead_this_I_am_s pammed_too_much @spamyourself.c omwrote:

>For example: It is easy to let JSP-pages communicate with each other. In PHP
>you'll need sessions or database, while J2EE can share (references to)
>objects that are in-process/memory.

Is it because of JSP, or because J2EE uses an application server? In
that case, it's not JSP itself that explains, but the fact that PHP
users don't (can't?) use an application server and rely on code pages
instead. Am I wrong?

>I don't know if J2EE will die, last year a few headhunters tried to get me
>back into J2EE (which I refused, alltough it pays well).
>That means that (at least in Europe) not enough people have J2EE skills
>these days.

Maybe they're moving to .Net.

**Jerry Stuckle** · Jul 31 '06, 04:55 PM

Re: PHP vs. J2EE

Luca wrote:

I am not a programmer but I do work in the ICT sector.
>
I read somewhere that J2EE would be "dying" and that PHP would be
taking its place soon...
Is this complete crap or does it have some real base ?
>
Regards
>

I doubt it. Both have advantages and disadvantages, and each can be the
better choice in different situations.

Of course, they said the same thing about COBOL in the late '70's.

--
=============== ===
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
JDS Computer Training Corp.
jstucklex@attgl obal.net
=============== ===

**Chung Leong** · Jul 31 '06, 04:55 PM

Re: PHP vs. J2EE

Luca wrote:

I am not a programmer but I do work in the ICT sector.
>
I read somewhere that J2EE would be "dying" and that PHP would be
taking its place soon...
Is this complete crap or does it have some real base ?
>
Regards

I see it as a case of living by the sword and dying by the sword. Much
the platform's popularity was due to aggressive marketing. Now that
market opinion is turning against it, it'll be hard to stop the slide.
If people believe that J2EE is dying, then it's true.

**Richard Levasseur** · Jul 31 '06, 05:25 PM

Re: PHP vs. J2EE

Erwin Moller wrote:

Luca wrote:
>

I am not a programmer but I do work in the ICT sector.

I read somewhere that J2EE would be "dying" and that PHP would be
taking its place soon...
Is this complete crap or does it have some real base ?

>
Hi Luca,
>
Difficult question.
I did J2EE for a few years but quited with it about 3-4 years ago.
In favor of PHP.
>
But J2EE and PHP are really 2 different beasts.
In very general words: J2EE is a lot more complex (from an users point of
view) and a lot harder to master than PHP.
>
Once you get confortable with PHP you can develop very fast: all functions
are build in PHP, and extending the language is relative easy (PEAR/PECL).
>
What I didn't like in J2EE was the fact I needed to browse through many
pages documentation all the time to get the job done. The number of classes
you need to master is huge.
>
Pro-J2EE: Once you know the basics (take a half year study/practice time
off), you just can do more than with PHP.
For example: It is easy to let JSP-pages communicate with each other. In PHP
you'll need sessions or database, while J2EE can share (references to)
objects that are in-process/memory.
>
I do miss a few possibilities I had in J2EE in PHP, but in general I am
happy I made the switch. PHP is language (for me) that I can fold the way I
think. That is something every proprammer likes. In Java I often had the
feeling I needed to do a lot of hard difficult work to get simple things
done.
>
To put it otherwise: Java/J2EE has a very steep learningcurve, where
everybody can get started with PHP, and get things done fast.
>
I don't know if J2EE will die, last year a few headhunters tried to get me
back into J2EE (which I refused, alltough it pays well).
That means that (at least in Europe) not enough people have J2EE skills
these days.
>
If someone asks me which language they should learn, I always advise PHP
because it is so easy to start with that most people will get motivated
fast, which is important. If you start with programming, and you start with
Java, chances are bigger that you'll quit with a frustrated feeling.
>
>
just my 2 cent.
>
Regards,
Erwin Moller
>

The irony is that, as PHP matures, its growing to resemble Java quite a
bit. Not that that is a bad thing, Java has some very good concepts.
The nice thing is that it doesn't have all the flaming hoops you
normally have to jump through in Java to get things done.

**Erwin Moller** · Aug 2 '06, 01:55 PM

Re: PHP vs. J2EE

Vincent Delporte wrote:

On Mon, 31 Jul 2006 17:43:13 +0200, Erwin Moller
<since_humans_r ead_this_I_am_s pammed_too_much @spamyourself.c omwrote:

>>For example: It is easy to let JSP-pages communicate with each other. In
>>PHP you'll need sessions or database, while J2EE can share (references to)
>>objects that are in-process/memory.

>
Is it because of JSP, or because J2EE uses an application server? In
that case, it's not JSP itself that explains, but the fact that PHP
users don't (can't?) use an application server and rely on code pages
instead. Am I wrong?

Hi Vincent,

J2EE is just a container in which Sun putted a lot of stuff, JSP/Servlets
just being one of them.
But JSP/Servlets DO expect an ApplicationCont ext and more to run anyway.
So I think the question if it is JSPs behaviour or it comes from the
applicationserv er is not relevant. Servlets are designed to run in that
environment.
You just cannot run a servlet outside of that context.
It wouldn't even compile.

>

>>I don't know if J2EE will die, last year a few headhunters tried to get me
>>back into J2EE (which I refused, alltough it pays well).
>>That means that (at least in Europe) not enough people have J2EE skills
>>these days.

>
Maybe they're moving to .Net.

I am afraid many do. :-/
But lets face the facts: M$ did a real good stealingjob (again) when
'inventing' their dotnet stuff.

Regards,
Erwin Moller

PHP vs. J2EE

PHP vs. J2EE

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