How about Ajax?

[Yarco]

I want to use "Ajax" to create my web for hobby.
But i don't know whether "Ajax" is mature...
And what about with php? Someone have experience on it?
....

[Tim Van Wassenhove]

Re: How about Ajax?

On 2005-09-16, Yarco <yarco.w@gmail. com> wrote:[color=blue]
> I want to use "Ajax" to create my web for hobby.
> But i don't know whether "Ajax" is mature...
> And what about with php? Someone have experience on it?[/color]

Might want to investigate your requirements first.
What do you really want to do?
Why do you think AJAX will help you achieve that goal?
Why do you think PHP will help you achieve that goal?

--
Met vriendelijke groeten,
Tim Van Wassenhove <http://timvw.madoka.be >

[Yarco]

Re: How about Ajax?

I want to know whether "Ajax" do have the ability to instead the normal
web programming.

[Erwin Moller]

Re: How about Ajax?

Yarco wrote:
[color=blue]
> I want to know whether "Ajax" do have the ability to instead the normal
> web programming.[/color]

Well, AJAX only gives you a clientsolution.
Like replacing pieces on a document with fresh material that is delivered
without a full page rebuild.
If you need databasequeries and the like, you still need to make the scripts
on the server.
I have looked at AJAX, but I don't see the point really. :-/
(I guess I am an oldfashioned guy.)
Maybe when you have a very heavyly filled page it makes sense to replace
just a part of it.

Some people claimed AJAX could prevent others from 'stealing' your content,
but that is not true. (It only makes it a little more work.)

just my 2 cents...
Don't flame me AJAX-fan. :-)

Regards,
Erwin Moller

[Justin Koivisto]

Re: How about Ajax?

Yarco wrote:[color=blue]
> I want to use "Ajax" to create my web for hobby.
> But i don't know whether "Ajax" is mature...
> And what about with php? Someone have experience on it?[/color]

"Ajax" is just a new term for something that has been around since the
late 1990's. Therefore, I'd have to say that it would be considered
"mature."

--
Justin Koivisto, ZCE - justin@koivi.co m

http://koivi.com

[Chung Leong]

Re: How about Ajax?


Justin Koivisto wrote:
[color=blue]
> "Ajax" is just a new term for something that has been around since the
> late 1990's. Therefore, I'd have to say that it would be considered
> "mature."[/color]

As we know with people, age often does not imply maturity :-)

[Tim Van Wassenhove]

Re: How about Ajax?

On 2005-09-16, Yarco <yarco.w@gmail. com> wrote:[color=blue]
> I want to know whether "Ajax" do have the ability to instead the normal
> web programming.[/color]

Could you reformulate that? Because i really don't understand what you
are trying to say.. "the ability to instead the normal web programming"



--
Met vriendelijke groeten,
Tim Van Wassenhove <http://timvw.madoka.be >

[Yarco]

Re: How about Ajax?

Well. For example:
I create several views: view1, view2, view3.
Using php with smarty, i select view1. Smarty will compile it into php,
and then into html. HTML will be send to the client.
But in Ajax:
I create several views: view1, view2, view3.
When i select view1. The view and the data will be download into client
end. And then compile them into html.(I don't know how to do it, but i
think it can be realized.)
The data and the view are distinguished. It is very clairly what the
client want to get.

[Manuel Lemos]

Re: How about Ajax?

Hello,

on 09/16/2005 08:50 AM Yarco said the following:[color=blue]
> I want to use "Ajax" to create my web for hobby.
> But i don't know whether "Ajax" is mature...
> And what about with php? Someone have experience on it?[/color]

AJAX is the hot topic of the moment since GMail started using it to
provide an highly interactive interface.

Before reinventing the wheel you may want to take a look at these AJAX
PHP classes that inclusively have been nominated to the PHP Programming
innovation award of August:

http://www.phpclasses.org/pajax

http://www.phpclasses.org/najax

http://www.phpclasses.org/httprequest

--

Regards,
Manuel Lemos

PHP Classes - Free ready to use OOP components written in PHP

http://www.phpclasses.org/

PHP Reviews - Reviews of PHP books and other products

http://www.phpclasses.org/reviews/

Metastorage - Data object relational mapping layer generator

http://www.meta-language.net/metastorage.html

[Tim Van Wassenhove]

Re: How about Ajax?

On 2005-09-18, Yarco <yarco.w@gmail. com> wrote:[color=blue]
> Well. For example:
> I create several views: view1, view2, view3.
> Using php with smarty, i select view1. Smarty will compile it into php,
> and then into html. HTML will be send to the client.
> But in Ajax:
> I create several views: view1, view2, view3.
> When i select view1. The view and the data will be download into client
> end. And then compile them into html.(I don't know how to do it, but i
> think it can be realized.)[/color]

If i understand it well, the only advantage you mention is that with
ajax you don't need to "load" the page again to change the presentation.

I can imagine uses for ajax, for example a chatbox, where you want to
update the messages.. without completely reloading the page..
[color=blue]
> The data and the view are distinguished. It is very clairly what the
> client want to get.[/color]

For this functionality, you could generate x(ht)ml.. With a bit of XSL
the user can get the data in the representation *he* wants.

--
Met vriendelijke groeten,
Tim Van Wassenhove <http://timvw.madoka.be >

[Tomi Holger Engdahl]

Re: How about Ajax?

"Yarco" <yarco.w@gmail. com> writes:
[color=blue]
> I want to use "Ajax" to create my web for hobby.
> But i don't know whether "Ajax" is mature...
> And what about with php? Someone have experience on it?[/color]

I have played a little bit with Ajax. Jut simple experiments
and planning to do some first real application sometimes.

Here are few AJAX related web pages that are really worth to see:

Sajax!

http://www.modernmethod.com/sajax/

Easy Ajax Programming (using XMLHttpRequest)

http://www.topfunky.net/cgi-local/article.pl/124

--
Tomi Engdahl (http://www.iki.fi/then/)
Take a look at my electronics web links and documents at

http://www.epanorama.net/

[Tomi Holger Engdahl]

Re: How about Ajax?

Erwin Moller <since_humans_r ead_this_I_am_s pammed_too_much @spamyourself.c om> writes:
[color=blue]
> Yarco wrote:
>[color=green]
> > I want to know whether "Ajax" do have the ability to instead the normal
> > web programming.[/color]
>
> Well, AJAX only gives you a clientsolution.
> Like replacing pieces on a document with fresh material that is delivered
> without a full page rebuild.
> If you need databasequeries and the like, you still need to make the scripts
> on the server.
> I have looked at AJAX, but I don't see the point really. :-/
> (I guess I am an oldfashioned guy.)[/color]

I many traditional web applications I don't see much point in
trying to push AJAX to them. But there are applications that
can be built in more user friendly way using AJAX.
The examples that I can think of are some web based user
interfaces. You can nicely get live updated from certain
inforamtion form the device being controller, and update
them on the fly to the visible web page without disturbing
other things done on the web page at the same time.
And those updates can be performed on mahy web brosers withotu seeing
that "flashing" that happens often when you reload the page.

AJAX technologies have already applied in such nice services
like Google Mail (www.gmail.com) and Google Maps (maps.google.co m).
Their user interface made in AJAX way is much more "slick" than
what coudl be done with traditional web interface.
I have used several web base map services and e-mail services
built using traditional web technioques, and their user
interface is not that good as in those "state of the art"
AJAX applications.

There are places where AJAX can help to make better user interface.
Lots of potential to help situations which are not well done
with traditional web.

But AJAX is not for everything and should
not be pushed for every application because some developers think
that it is "cool". Ajax is not perferct and has it's problems.
I will expect to see AJAX to be musused in very many situations
in the applications where is not really needed and does not
make things any better (easily worse if not used properly!).
This has happened already for other new web techniques,
and I expect tha history repeats itself.

Ajax Mistakes

http://sourcelabs.com/ajb/archives/2005/05/ajax_mistakes.html

"Ajax is an awesome technology that is driving a new generation of web
apps, from maps.google.com to colr.org to backpackit.com. But Ajax is
also a dangerous technology for web developers, its power introduces a
huge amount of UI problems as well as server side state problems and
server load problems."
[color=blue]
> Maybe when you have a very heavyly filled page it makes sense to replace
> just a part of it.[/color]

There are applications where this makes sense.

Using AJAX is not the only way to replace just part of a web page.
[color=blue]
> Some people claimed AJAX could prevent others from 'stealing' your content,
> but that is not true. (It only makes it a little more work.)[/color]

I don't see how AJAX could prevent other people from 'stealing' your
content. Using AJAX might make stealing a little bit harder on
some cases for some users when technology is new, but I think
that the effect of it as protection will soon drop
(similar protection level like with other Javascript trics
that are not really secure). Using AJAX as the only way to
get to the content might also stop some legitime users from
getting to you content (AJAX does not work on every
browser in the world and Javascript needed in AJAX is disabled
by the user in the web browser for security reasons).

--
Tomi Engdahl (http://www.iki.fi/then/)
Take a look at my electronics web links and documents at

http://www.epanorama.net/