Re: Rethinking My Use of Modal Windows....

[Prisoner at War]

On May 2, 4:31 pm, Ben C <spams...@spam. eggswrote:

>
>
Easily done.

I found this code at http://colorado-springs.pm.org/balloonHint.html
but the site doesn't seem to provide a working example!

Don't use a real modal window, instead use a "Web 2.0 popup".

Yeah, something like that Kontera in-line text stuff, except totally
client-side...hmmm, actually, that Kontera stuff can be annoying,
too...better switch back to onClick, since onMouseOver can be
accidental...wh at I will do with an onMouseOver, however, is make the
"link" or "linking/summoning element" get highlighted, as if
"warning"...goo d idea, you think? This way, it's not "in-your-
face"...don't want to be in-your-face to my visitors, even if it's
relevant information....

Get a DIV, give it a transparent background and a background image that
looks like a speech bubble, with transparent pixels around its rounded
corners. Make the DIV visibility: hidden.
>
Then use JS to change it to visibility: visible when you want it to pop
up. The rest of the page won't be frozen.

Thanks, that sounds like a plan! I don't see the concrete steps
involved due to my present technical limitations, but the broad
contours of your suggestion sound like something I can learn to
achieve!

Fading away can be done but is a bit more tricky. You'd need to set the
element's opacity gradually from 1.0 to 0.0 before making it visibility:
hidden when it reached 0. For that you use setInterval (or setTimeout
but I prefer setInterval). I think we explained this the other day.

Indeed, for which I am very grateful -- I am able to make text fade
in, now...ideally the whole "box" or "balloon" should fade in, but the
text itself fading in is impressive and very nice. Then again, maybe
one fade effect is plenty -- maybe instead of fade-out the balloon or
box should just disappear ASAP....

[Jeff]

Re: Rethinking My Use of Modal Windows....

Prisoner at War wrote:

On May 2, 4:31 pm, Ben C <spams...@spam. eggswrote:

>>
>Easily done.

>
I found this code at http://colorado-springs.pm.org/balloonHint.html
but the site doesn't seem to provide a working example!

That's just a regular popup window.

>

>Don't use a real modal window, instead use a "Web 2.0 popup".

Perhaps Ben will write a simple example for you, I'm too sleepy at
the moment to dig mine out.

Jeff

>
Yeah, something like that Kontera in-line text stuff, except totally
client-side...hmmm, actually, that Kontera stuff can be annoying,
too...better switch back to onClick, since onMouseOver can be
accidental...wh at I will do with an onMouseOver, however, is make the
"link" or "linking/summoning element" get highlighted, as if
"warning"...goo d idea, you think? This way, it's not "in-your-
face"...don't want to be in-your-face to my visitors, even if it's
relevant information....
>

>Get a DIV, give it a transparent background and a background image that
>looks like a speech bubble, with transparent pixels around its rounded
>corners. Make the DIV visibility: hidden.
>>
>Then use JS to change it to visibility: visible when you want it to pop
>up. The rest of the page won't be frozen.

>
Thanks, that sounds like a plan! I don't see the concrete steps
involved due to my present technical limitations, but the broad
contours of your suggestion sound like something I can learn to
achieve!
>

>Fading away can be done but is a bit more tricky. You'd need to set the
>element's opacity gradually from 1.0 to 0.0 before making it visibility:
>hidden when it reached 0. For that you use setInterval (or setTimeout
>but I prefer setInterval). I think we explained this the other day.

>
Indeed, for which I am very grateful -- I am able to make text fade
in, now...ideally the whole "box" or "balloon" should fade in, but the
text itself fading in is impressive and very nice. Then again, maybe
one fade effect is plenty -- maybe instead of fade-out the balloon or
box should just disappear ASAP....

[Ben C]

Re: Rethinking My Use of Modal Windows....

On 2008-05-03, Jeff <jeff@spam_me_n ot.comwrote:

Prisoner at War wrote:

>On May 2, 4:31 pm, Ben C <spams...@spam. eggswrote:

>>>
>>Easily done.

>>
>I found this code at http://colorado-springs.pm.org/balloonHint.html
>but the site doesn't seem to provide a working example!

>
That's just a regular popup window.

>>

>>Don't use a real modal window, instead use a "Web 2.0 popup".

>
Perhaps Ben will write a simple example for you, I'm too sleepy at
the moment to dig mine out.

Here you are:

http://www.tidraso.co.uk/misc/bubble/

I don't do much JavaScript usually so this is unlikely to be the best
way of doing it. And it probably won't work in IE.

Question: at the moment each <span class="bubble"h as to have a unique
id just so I can identify it in createBubble. What's the best way of
avoiding that?

For example can the JS just create a bubble on the most recently parsed
node? Then the position of the SCRIPT elements in the document would
contain all the information necessary about where to attach the bubbles.

[dorayme]

Re: Rethinking My Use of Modal Windows....

In article <slrng1o9ke.i35 .spamspam@bowse r.marioworld>,
Ben C <spamspam@spam. eggswrote:

On 2008-05-03, Jeff <jeff@spam_me_n ot.comwrote:

Prisoner at War wrote:

On May 2, 4:31 pm, Ben C <spams...@spam. eggswrote:
>>
>Easily done.
>
I found this code at http://colorado-springs.pm.org/balloonHint.html
but the site doesn't seem to provide a working example!

That's just a regular popup window.

>
>Don't use a real modal window, instead use a "Web 2.0 popup".

Perhaps Ben will write a simple example for you, I'm too sleepy at
the moment to dig mine out.

>
Here you are:
>
http://www.tidraso.co.uk/misc/bubble/

Brilliant in Mac FF and Opera but not right in Safari 2, iCab. The
bubbles are very partially shown, the left bits, in the latter two.

--
dorayme

[Ben C]

Re: Rethinking My Use of Modal Windows....

On 2008-05-03, dorayme <doraymeRidThis @optusnet.com.a uwrote:

In article <slrng1o9ke.i35 .spamspam@bowse r.marioworld>,
Ben C <spamspam@spam. eggswrote:
>

>On 2008-05-03, Jeff <jeff@spam_me_n ot.comwrote:

Prisoner at War wrote:
>On May 2, 4:31 pm, Ben C <spams...@spam. eggswrote:
>>>
>>Easily done.
>>
>I found this code at http://colorado-springs.pm.org/balloonHint.html
>but the site doesn't seem to provide a working example!
>
That's just a regular popup window.
>>
>>Don't use a real modal window, instead use a "Web 2.0 popup".
>
Perhaps Ben will write a simple example for you, I'm too sleepy at
the moment to dig mine out.

>>
>Here you are:
>>
> http://www.tidraso.co.uk/misc/bubble/

>
Brilliant in Mac FF and Opera but not right in Safari 2, iCab. The
bubbles are very partially shown, the left bits, in the latter two.

Probably because I'm using an inline box to form the containing block
for positioned descendents. The very thing I warned Mr Korpela about
only the other day :) Although there the circumstances required more
precision.

Konqueror positions all the bubbles at the left of the block-- basically
it looks like it doesn't really allow inline containing blocks.

There isn't really an easy fix for that, except redesign the page so the
items that need bubbles are all blocks (including floats).

Also in Konqueror my default font is nice and big and the text doesn't
therefore fit in the last bubble. This is a fundamental problem of
trying to fit text into something that's sized in pixels.

Actually one could do bubbles sized in ems using IMG rather than
background-image...

And they don't fade properly in Konqueror because the version I have at
least doesn't support opacity. So they just disappear, but that could be
called reasonably graceful degradation.

[dorayme]

Re: Rethinking My Use of Modal Windows....

In article <slrng1oc5v.i35 .spamspam@bowse r.marioworld>,
Ben C <spamspam@spam. eggswrote:

On 2008-05-03, dorayme <doraymeRidThis @optusnet.com.a uwrote:

In article <slrng1o9ke.i35 .spamspam@bowse r.marioworld>,
Ben C <spamspam@spam. eggswrote:

On 2008-05-03, Jeff <jeff@spam_me_n ot.comwrote:
Prisoner at War wrote:
On May 2, 4:31 pm, Ben C <spams...@spam. eggswrote:
>>
>Easily done.
>
I found this code at http://colorado-springs.pm.org/balloonHint.html
but the site doesn't seem to provide a working example!

That's just a regular popup window.
>
>Don't use a real modal window, instead use a "Web 2.0 popup".

Perhaps Ben will write a simple example for you, I'm too sleepy at
the moment to dig mine out.
>
Here you are:
>
http://www.tidraso.co.uk/misc/bubble/

Brilliant in Mac FF and Opera but not right in Safari 2, iCab. The
bubbles are very partially shown, the left bits, in the latter two.

>

....

Actually one could do bubbles sized in ems using IMG rather than
background-image...
>

I was thinking this last. Perhaps, given the tricky nature of this task
and cost-benefit, just pics of text to go in pics of bubbles. And make
big enough for most people?

--
dorayme

[Ben C]

Re: Rethinking My Use of Modal Windows....

On 2008-05-03, dorayme <doraymeRidThis @optusnet.com.a uwrote:

In article <slrng1oc5v.i35 .spamspam@bowse r.marioworld>,
Ben C <spamspam@spam. eggswrote:

[...]

>Actually one could do bubbles sized in ems using IMG rather than
>background-image...
>>

I was thinking this last. Perhaps, given the tricky nature of this task
and cost-benefit, just pics of text to go in pics of bubbles. And make
big enough for most people?

Good idea. Then you can also use a cartoony font.

I can't help thinking that anyone sensible enough to worry about font
sizes and readability isn't going to be doing fading-out pop-up speech
bubbles in the first place.

[dorayme]

Re: Rethinking My Use of Modal Windows....

In article <slrng1odre.i35 .spamspam@bowse r.marioworld>,
Ben C <spamspam@spam. eggswrote:

On 2008-05-03, dorayme <doraymeRidThis @optusnet.com.a uwrote:

In article <slrng1oc5v.i35 .spamspam@bowse r.marioworld>,
Ben C <spamspam@spam. eggswrote:

[...]

Actually one could do bubbles sized in ems using IMG rather than
background-image...
>

I was thinking this last. Perhaps, given the tricky nature of this task
and cost-benefit, just pics of text to go in pics of bubbles. And make
big enough for most people?

>
Good idea. Then you can also use a cartoony font.
>
I can't help thinking that anyone sensible enough to worry about font
sizes and readability isn't going to be doing fading-out pop-up speech
bubbles in the first place.

Probably not! Also on the cards are animated gifs, positioned or
whatever. You could, I suppose, do all the fading in them...

Confession, I went through a small love affair with the animated gif
once. And this talk of cartoons has reminded me. This was part of a long
story and I think I can do much better these days... but here are a
couple of oldies:

<http://dorayme.890m.co m/alt/pics/boastfulA.gif>

and

<http://dorayme.890m.co m/alt/pics/proudZ.gif>

For some reason, it looks a bit corny now to me. (Travis, you fancy
Flash geek, please don't laugh!)

--
dorayme

[Prisoner at War]

Re: Rethinking My Use of Modal Windows....

On May 3, 4:47 am, Ben C <spams...@spam. eggswrote:

On 2008-05-03, Jeff <jeff@spam_me_n ot.comwrote:
>

Prisoner at War wrote:

On May 2, 4:31 pm, Ben C <spams...@spam. eggswrote:

>

>Easily done.

>

I found this code athttp://colorado-springs.pm.org/balloonHint.htm l
but the site doesn't seem to provide a working example!

>

That's just a regular popup window.

>

>Don't use a real modal window, instead use a "Web 2.0 popup".

>

Perhaps Ben will write a simple example for you, I'm too sleepy at
the moment to dig mine out.

>
Here you are:
>

http://www.tidraso.co.uk/misc/bubble/

>
I don't do much JavaScript usually so this is unlikely to be the best
way of doing it. And it probably won't work in IE.
>
Question: at the moment each <span class="bubble"h as to have a unique
id just so I can identify it in createBubble. What's the best way of
avoiding that?
>
For example can the JS just create a bubble on the most recently parsed
node? Then the position of the SCRIPT elements in the document would
contain all the information necessary about where to attach the bubbles.

GOOD GOD!!!

YOU, LIKE, SCANNED MY BRAIN!!!!

That's really scary stuff, man! Did you install some kind of spyware
on my computer through one of these newsgroups????

Holy cow, that's ***199%*** EXACTLY what I'd been looking for!!!

What is it you do for a living, besides practice remote MRI???

Any hot stock tips, BTW, Ben???

Holy cow, you must be a great person to have at a party! ^_^

Sorry I can't help you with your questions (even though I know you
weren't asking *moi*)...I'm going to go try to digest your script and
see if I can at least hack it for my purposes (namely, the "fade-
timeOut"), much less comprehend it....

Honestly, thanks, Ben. That's absolutely incredible. I'm putting you
and these newsgroups up in an "acknowledgment s" page on my site...let
me know if you want a link to your blog or something; I'll put it in
there. That goes for all you folks who have helped -- you know who
you are. A seriously big thank-you. Wow.

[Prisoner at War]

Re: Rethinking My Use of Modal Windows....

On May 3, 5:59 am, Ben C <spams...@spam. eggswrote:

>
>
Good idea. Then you can also use a cartoony font.
>
I can't help thinking that anyone sensible enough to worry about font
sizes and readability isn't going to be doing fading-out pop-up speech
bubbles in the first place.

Now now, don't be such a snob about it...I know it looks silly, but
hey, so are flowers!

Anyway, I promise to use them very judiciously...I was all set to go
with modal windows, then realized that they're too in-your-face,
freezing the browser like that, demanding an onClick to return to
normal viewing...so a dialog balloon is much better, you see...and
given the theme of my site, a comic book style one rather fits more
than not.

I definitely shan't be doing a "comic sans" font, though! Don't want
to get carried away here...actually , I will be trying to change the
colors of your balloons -- that's just too in-your-face-khaki, don't
you think! ;-)

Thanks again. Wow, you've just made my weekend, dude!!

[Prisoner at War]

Re: Rethinking My Use of Modal Windows....

On May 3, 5:51 am, dorayme <doraymeRidT... @optusnet.com.a uwrote:

>
>
I was thinking this last. Perhaps, given the tricky nature of this task
and cost-benefit, just pics of text to go in pics of bubbles. And make
big enough for most people?

LOL, that's an idea! I'm still thinking in HTML terms, but I suppose
with CSS it's possible to, say, set up a <divas a layer and have it
contain an <imgof the balloon with text -- would that be your
strategy? Using CSS to position the <imgprecisely on the page, when
called....

--
dorayme

[Prisoner at War]

Re: Rethinking My Use of Modal Windows....

On May 3, 6:54 am, dorayme <doraymeRidT... @optusnet.com.a uwrote:

>
>
Probably not! Also on the cards are animated gifs, positioned or
whatever. You could, I suppose, do all the fading in them...

Cards?

Confession, I went through a small love affair with the animated gif
once.

Of course, everybody did -- I particularly remember those mailboxes
set up to run like a mouth, flapping as if in gossip! They're still
hilarious, you know, like the "download-the-web" .gif on
w3schools.com.. ..

And this talk of cartoons has reminded me. This was part of a long
story and I think I can do much better these days... but here are a
couple of oldies:
>
<http://dorayme.890m.co m/alt/pics/boastfulA.gif>
>
and
>
<http://dorayme.890m.co m/alt/pics/proudZ.gif>
>
For some reason, it looks a bit corny now to me. (Travis, you fancy
Flash geek, please don't laugh!)

Hey, that's really neat! I particularly liked the "boastful A"...wow,
some truly creative people here! So you folks are mainly graphic
artists and designers who picked up some scripting for web work,
right? I'm impressed. Me, I'm just a dabbler. I like intellectual
fun, even if it's too much for me most of the time!

--
dorayme

[Prisoner at War]

Re: Rethinking My Use of Modal Windows....

On May 3, 1:46 am, Jeff <jeff@spam_me_n ot.comwrote:

>
>
That's just a regular popup window.

Is it? None to be found on that site anyway, it seems. Wonder why a
Perl guy would call a JavaScript pop-up a "help balloon"...even HTML
alt/title attributes would better qualify!

Perhaps Ben will write a simple example for you, I'm too sleepy at
the moment to dig mine out.
>
Jeff

Dude, thanks for the assist! It's too bad his JavaScript isn't
accepted by IE7 at all ("object doesn't support this property or
method"); hopefully I can find a fix for that! Why does the IE DOM
seem to always be an issue???

[Jonathan N. Little]

Re: Rethinking My Use of Modal Windows....

Prisoner at War wrote:

Why does the IE DOM seem to always be an issue???

Because it's <slowly style="patroniz ing">special!</slowly>

Seriously, same reason we battle with it with CSS.


--
Take care,

Jonathan
-------------------
LITTLE WORKS STUDIO

http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com

[Ben C]

Re: Rethinking My Use of Modal Windows....

On 2008-05-03, Prisoner at War <prisoner_at_wa r@yahoo.comwrot e:

On May 3, 5:59 am, Ben C <spams...@spam. eggswrote:

>>
>>
>Good idea. Then you can also use a cartoony font.
>>
>I can't help thinking that anyone sensible enough to worry about font
>sizes and readability isn't going to be doing fading-out pop-up speech
>bubbles in the first place.

>
Now now, don't be such a snob about it...I know it looks silly, but
hey, so are flowers!

I don't mind if it's silly. It's your website, put whatever you want on
it.

Anyway, I promise to use them very judiciously...I was all set to go
with modal windows, then realized that they're too in-your-face,
freezing the browser like that, demanding an onClick to return to
normal viewing...so a dialog balloon is much better, you see...and
given the theme of my site, a comic book style one rather fits more
than not.
>
I definitely shan't be doing a "comic sans" font, though! Don't want
to get carried away here...actually , I will be trying to change the
colors of your balloons -- that's just too in-your-face-khaki, don't
you think! ;-)

You can probably also draw less wobbly balloons.

What you might want to do is to start the fade out on the mouseout
event. That way slow readers can hold the mouse on the element if they
want to read the text without it disappearing.